between pre amp and electronic crossover

[renxun]

actually does this 2 item function as the same thing? or does the pre-amp actually is some sort of equalizer that boost and cut certain "preset" frequency unlike the equalizer which had more band to fine tune.

because for my subwoofer im not too satisfied with the performance and although im using electronic crossover , d sound is still quite hard compared to my friend's system which using d preamp to only control the sub for their low,deep and loud sound.....

meaning to say my sub's sq is not too satisfying and i would like to knw whether pre-amp helps

 

[Adeen]

nice question here....anybody care to help...i'm confused with all these gadgets...

 

[oldskolboyz]

Anything place between HU & Amp & also required current to operate, we call it Pre-Amp.. Pre-amp is the general name for:-

a) Parametric Equalizer
b) Graphic Equalizer
c) Analog Equalizer
d) Line Driver/Overdriver
e) Electronic Crossover
f) Digital Processor etc Alpine H700/701/900, Pioner RS-P90/DEQ-P9/90
g) Phass Adjustment
h) Epicenter & etc...


I think U refer to Parametric Equalizer vs Electronic crossover it's....

Active Crossover
An active crossover is also referred to as an electronic crossover because it requires power and ground connections in order to do its job. It is installed between your receiver or equalizer and your amplifiers. An active crossover filters and directs the frequency bands in the low level signal before they reach the amplifiers. This saves your amps from doing unnecessary work, making your system more efficient.

Active crossovers are usually adjustable, giving you more flexibility and letting you tweak the sound to meet the needs of your vehicle. They often have other features like bass boost and let you independently control the relative volume of different types of speakers.

a) Bandpass Filter- A bandpass filter combines a high-pass filter and low-pass filter, allowing a certain band of frequencies to pass while restricting the higher and lower frequencies. Bandpass filters can be fixed in frequency and bandwidth, or variable. "refer to MidBass driver"

b) High-pass Filter- A high-pass filter allows "high" frequencies to be sent to the speakers, while it blocks frequencies below the crossover point. "refer to tweeter"

c) Low-pass Filter- A low-pass filter removes frequencies above the crossover point, while allowing "lows" to pass on to the speakers (typically subwoofers). "refer to Sub-woofer"

Parametric Equalizer
Parametric equalization or tone controls allow you to set not only the amount in dB by which a certain frequency band is boost or cut, but also the width and/or center frequency of this band. This gives you extremely precise control of the tonal balance in your vehicle. Parametric equalizers are more versatile than graphic equalizers, which have fixed center frequencies and bandwidths.

Graphic EQ
A graphic, or passive, EQ is the standard type of equalizer that usually has 5 to 12 slider controls on the face. These sliders let you boost or cut certain frequencies, giving you a high level of control over the tonal quality of your music. The width of each band is fixed and cannot be adjusted (unlike a Parametric EQ).


U have a prob with the sub is kicking too harder it's... Ur installer doesn't know how to tune the electronic crossover, for U info not all seller know how to tune the e/cross.. With proper tuning U wont have a prob.. My advise is try yourself 1st.. turn down Low Pass (LP) knob for sub from 100hz until U can get good upfront bass... Std LP for SQ is around 60hz-70hz.. Std LP for SPL is around 90hz-120hz...

 

[renxun]

thank you so much for your feedback... however besides the frequency on the electronic crossover, there is also another frequency adjuster at the monoblock there... and since those gadgets were bought and installed DIY so the adjustment at the amp i normally will put to "half" and the gain is around 1/3 of the total..for the amp side there are adjustment... it can be quite confusing when there is so many adjustment which can be made...

and also what you mean is to try adjusting the sound myself first b4 making any decision of any need to purchase the parametric equalizer issit?

 

[oldskolboyz]

thank you so much for your feedback... however besides the frequency on the electronic crossover, there is also another frequency adjuster at the monoblock there... and since those gadgets were bought and installed DIY so the adjustment at the amp i normally will put to "half" and the gain is around 1/3 of the total..for the amp side there are adjustment... it can be quite confusing when there is so many adjustment which can be made...?

Only 1 filter can be use either use built-in at HU, Amp or external e/cross. In Ur case.. before going futher, can U list down what equip U have at this moment.. Brand/model for HU, Amp, Electronic crossover & sub woofer..

and also what you mean is to try adjusting the sound myself first b4 making any decision of any need to purchase the parametric equalizer issit?

Parametric Equalizer or ParaQ not helping U to get Deep & Soft bass but percentage to invite noise or AirAsia flying in ur car is high..

U can see clearly at the ParaQ & E/crossover what the feature it has..

 

[cacin]

What oldskol mentions already sums up most of the confusion between the pre-amp thing. The note that I want to highlight is, some graphic EQ are also designed to look like a parametric eq. The cap ayam one with knobs. Those can be said as graphic too right? I think a parametric EQ must have the ability to adjust the bandwidth (Q factor).
One other thing, If you have multiple slope crossover working, you will have a different slope in the end. IE: Hu LP at xxHz at -6dB, E-X-over LP at yyHz at -18db and amp LP at zzHz at -12dB. There is a formula to calculate the slope (but I forgot). The question of what is the actual LP frequency in the end - I have no idea. Need to check back my book.

 

[oldskolboyz]

Diff Parametric vs Graphic is..

a) Parametric got Sub level control & lesser band like 3 or 4 bands only
c) Graphic dont have Sub level control & more band like 5 or 7 bands

 

[cacin]

Diff Parametric vs Graphic is..

a) Parametric got Sub level control & lesser band like 3 or 4 bands only
c) Graphic dont have Sub level control & more band like 5 or 7 bands

Add-ons:
Parametric - can control bandwidth (Q factor).
Graphic - Cannot control bandwidth.

Parametric - you can set the centre frequency. boost and cut at centre frequency.
Graphic - the frequency already set. Can only adjust boost & cut.


Example:
Parametric: The EQ in DEH-P5750 & newer models, KDC-X7529,
Graphic: The EQ in CDX-V5800, ERA-G320, Winamp's standard EQ.

Take note that some EQ with a lot of bands are still parametric if you can adjust the centre frequency and Q factor. Example: the EQ in some of Alpine high end HU or processor (PXA-H400 & PXA-H600). Both the PXA mentioned comes with 5 or more bands parametric EQ. The best way to know about a certain product that you're interested in is to get the user manual first and read through before you decide whether to buy or not. :D

 

[oldskolboyz]

Add-ons:
Parametric - can control bandwidth (Q factor).
Graphic - Cannot control bandwidth.

Parametric - you can set the centre frequency. boost and cut at centre frequency.
Graphic - the frequency already set. Can only adjust boost & cut.


Example:
Parametric: The EQ in DEH-P5750 & newer models, KDC-X7529,
Graphic: The EQ in CDX-V5800, ERA-G320, Winamp's standard EQ.

Take note that some EQ with a lot of bands are still parametric if you can adjust the centre frequency and Q factor. Example: the EQ in some of Alpine high end HU or processor (PXA-H400 & PXA-H600). Both the PXA mentioned comes with 5 or more bands parametric EQ. The best way to know about a certain product that you're interested in is to get the user manual first and read through before you decide whether to buy or not. :D

Sorry for my post.... something wrong with me, oledi confuse even I use it before.... to many thing in my head oledi....

Graphic, Parametric, Bandwith/Q factor, Center frequency, Narrow, Wide, boosting, Cutting, Roll off bottom, roll off top, audio spectrum, 1/3 octave, analog & digital.............

 

[Zenn]

if using electronic crossover then dont use the amp's crossover (lowpass/highpass filter)

 

[Adeen]

tumpang abit here...

so, say i got a,
pioneer deh4950mp
3 way crossover
600w 4 channel amp
480w 2 channel amp(cap aym)
2 front speakers(located in dash)
2 rear speakers (3 way)
and a subwoofer...

do i need to install a paraQ to make it sound better..??
since i've only connected the 4 channel to the sub and front speakers..

 

[Zenn]

better save your money and get a better HU, cheap pre amps only induce unwanted noise into system...

 

[oldskolboyz]

pioneer deh4950mp..

For simple set-up just use it.. quit good for ppl not serious in ICE.. oledi got
a) 3 pair RCA = Front/Rear/Sub same as Ur XO output it's..
b) 3 band ParaQ = why U need external paraQ
c) 2 way Xo = Front & Rear (HP, 50/63/80/100/125Hz), Sub (LP, 50/63/80/100/125Hz), so why U need XO......

In simple/budget set-up like U, ppl only bought external paraQ or Xo when their HU only got 1 pair pre-out... for serious ppl their use external XO or all in 1 processor (H701), the cost also can buy 3/4 unit yours DEH-4950MP or more...

3 way crossover

Yours 3 way XO got LOW/MID/Tweet ouput ka? or Front/Rear/Sub, this only 2way leerr.. If Cap ayam 1, sale it to others ppl who really need it...

600w 4 channel amp
480w 2 channel amp(cap ayam)

4ch amp use for Front & rear, 2Ch amp use for Sub woofer.... all direct connect from HU.. all feature at the amp set at flat/full range/off.. just use gain knob.. to macth the signal & speaker.. Xo & equalizer use built-in at HU but loudness & BBE feature switch off laaaa..

2 front speakers(located in dash)

Mean 4" coaxial or full range 1 ka?, what I can suggest is upgrade it to component set 6.5".. which U can afford 1 laa.. but not Mohawk or others cap abang 1 laaa..

2 rear speakers (3 way)

Sale it to your frend or install into your father car, if U dont want to lose money.. Use ur existing 4" (front speaker) for rear fill.......

and a subwoofer...

If Ur 2ch amp can bigger pwr at bridge mode & enough to pwr ur subwoofer than use it.....

do i need to install a paraQ to make it sound better..??

Definitely nope.. spend that money for front component set 100x better than paraQ.....

since i've only connected the 4 channel to the sub and front speakers..

What Ur prob here............

 

[Adeen]

wah....u guyz very resourceful...
i'm not the kao kao ICE type...
just normal2 one oni...
that's why i just got the pioneer 4950...

600w amp is prestige brand...
ya la...mine not 3 way XO...2 way oni...wat a waste like dis...

so here...if i get the 6.5....where do i put it..??
i dun think it will fit in the dash...if put other place would not be nice..
my car is old toyota...

i've only installed the 4 channel to sub and front speakers....
so haven't installed the rest yet...

i really dun know how to use the setup for the HU...
confusing....
total newbie here....

 

[renxun]

if using electronic crossover then dont use the amp's crossover (lowpass/highpass filter)

then the amp there how to set? set to full frequency pass? since using the electronic crossover filter...

 

[Zenn]

then the amp there how to set? set to full frequency pass? since using the electronic crossover filter...

if can off, off better la, if kenot, full range osso can...

 

[Zenn]

adeen, put the 6.5" in the door la, no other place, find a good shop can do a good job for u...

 

[oldskolboyz]

so here...if I get the 6.5....where do I put it..??
I dun think it will fit in the dash...if put other place would not be nice..
my car is old toyota......

Door panel lorr... last time I have seen old kancil put 8" at door panel... hee hee.. If to 6.5" to big, so try find 5.25" 1 laaa..

I really dun know how to use the setup for the HU...
confusing..

Read your manual lorrr under "Audio Adjustment" section.............

 

[Adeen]

thnx sifu's for the great feedback...

one thing i wanna ask....how much does an RCA cable cost...??
for normal ICE player like me...

 

[oldskolboyz]

thnx sifu's for the great feedback...

one thing i wanna ask....how much does an RCA cable cost...??
for normal ICE player like me...

Depend on where the amp location...
a) Amp under Ur front seat, should be 2 - 2.5 meter..
b) Amp in the boot at rear seat, should be 3.5 - 4 meter..

for beginner I think Belden rca cable should be good oledi.. price? try look "Grexer", he selling it in custome length...

http://www.gr8tunes.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8661

If U are looking good amp take this 2 PPI A404 & PPI 300..

http://www.gr8tunes.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8697