Force Induction : Any Options for 4AGs?

[synchron]

Centrifugal s/c are the cheapeast s/c around if you are comparing with new ones.

The engine build is very important for the s/c. If the engine has more power then the s/c will generate more power. We are only talking about 1 bar boost here with stock ecu, injectors and engine.

We must face the fact that our engine is smaller in cc. Dont aspect it to generate more power than the bigger cc engine. Smaller cc engine are more favourable to centrifugal s/c because they can generate the boost faster and also higher rev limit. While bigger cc engine are more favourable to screw type supercharger.

 

[-e f i n i-]

so, with that centrifugal unit on, if we set larger boost, bigger injectors + the usual crap, how much can we expect to get? 300hp possible? but if we use a TD06 instead, can we expect more power?
i see mostly vortech supports boost only up to 1.3bar.
A SC is by all means more expensive than a turbocharger, if the power gain we can get from both is almost the same, is it worth to pay a lot more just for the response of the SC?
but Rm7K... and we can get a TD06 for less than 2K, but surely it isnt the ball bearing type.
By Pass valves are for SCs right? Do they maKE any noise like BOVs?

Changing pulleys for superchargers only make the power come earlier, right? and by itself does no change in powergains?
oh yea... pulleys do apply for centrifugal right? roots type looks a lot different than centrifugal. centrifugal just looks like a snail to me.

btw, any 1.8L or 2L stroker kits for 20V? :p

 

[synchron]

U cant compare a new s/c to an used turbo. No need to use by pass if you are using 4agze engine and its manifold. Changing pulley itself will increase it boost and the boost will come in earlier.

My s/c will be spining 3 times the speed of the Vortechs and also it will create more boost because it is custom for smaller engine and it is also light weight.

 

[-e f i n i-]

You mean, we dont need bypass even if we're running on higher boost?
How if im using 20V?
Is your centrifugal sc some custom unit? Rm7K for tht unit you were mentioning bout?
i still dont understand the term create more boost. i thought boost is something u set to make the FI work harder or something to crank more power out of it... forgive me for my noobness.

 

[synchron]

You will need a by pass valve if ur throttle is after the s/c.

Air going to s/c then only throttle body then you will need bypass valve.

If air is going through throttle body only to s/c then you will not a bypass valve. Just like the 4agze system, you can with or without a by pass valve. The bypass valve will not make any sound like the blowoff valve.

The step-up gear ratio of my s/c is 10.148:1 ratio and the Vortechs is having a 3.45:1 gear ratio. At engine rpm of 1000 my supercharger will be spinning at 10,148 rpm and the Vortech will only be spinning at 3450 rpm.

When a supercharger is spining faster then it wil have a bigger and faster boost. Boost normally comes in about 20000 to 25000 s/c RPM. Imagine which charger will have more boost and which charger boost will come faster.

 

[rollakid]

Efini, don't worry about u can go out, just keep ur study well yah........ when u finish the exam, let's see can come out drink with tauhu`2, rollakid, artnet, rapheal them. arr...... get intro my other friend too to u guys....also 20v kaki....cheers

rain like this.. go out also no fun -__-

A SC is by all means more expensive than a turbocharger, if the power gain we can get from both is almost the same, is it worth to pay a lot more just for the response of the SC?

very subjective ler.. to see there's ppl who is willing to spend that much money to get only 30hp more from NA...

My s/c will be spining 3 times the speed of the Vortechs and also it will create more boost because it is custom for smaller engine and it is also light weight.

well, there's only two s/c that according to the figures on the paper that spin faster than your s/c, if its the same one you mention last time, both from rotrex, one way faster, but for really small engine only, one abit faster, but the power rating is about the same one as you give, so asume its more or less the same :D

 

[synchron]

Rotrex are great but they are really expensive. Their step-up is 9.48:1 and they have a very high s/c rpm.

In asia, the only place to purchase them is from HKS.

 

[-e f i n i-]

hmm... but your SC step up is higher wor.... isnt the higher the better?
hmm... so basically, if your SC is used, add all the normal usual junk and its possible to crank 300hp+ from it? Power loss to operate the Sc depends on the size too right? But normally, after taking the power loss into account, usually there wouldnt be any negative power gains would there? I mean, SC Unit A is supposed to add an extra 100hp, but because of the power used to spin the SC, it takes away 110hp. tht rarely happens right?
So, is it that, if we put a larger supercharger on a smaller engine, it would just be a pain in the neck to have it spun to an optimal RPM right? negative power gains?

crap, i think im just asking toooooo many silly questions

 

[synchron]

Yes! the step-up gear ratio, the higher the better. Centrifugal s/c is lighter to spin the root s/c. Roots charger will loose more power at first in order to be spin. The bigger the roots charger is, the harder to spin. It also the roots charger will lag a little.

Both centrifugal sc and the screw type sc will gain advantage over this problem, because both these charger are much easier to spin and make more power.

To choose a bigger s/c will also be determine at the base hp and displacement of the engine. The bigger the compressor wheel is, it need to spin in a higher speed.

That is why alot of small engine users are complainning about Vortech sc that they only have boost or power coming in after 4000 RPM.

 

[rollakid]

i've read bout topfuel dragster's root type s/c takes more power to spin than a dodge viper can produce... dunno true or not..

 

[synchron]

Yes! but their car dont have high rpm and also they have very high displacement engine, at least 5000cc and above. Those topfuel dragters are making about 5000 hp and 4-5 sec quarter mile.

 

[rollakid]

8 liter v8 8000hp at near 8000rpm.

1 speed gearbox, but clutch got 5 piece that engage one by one, so abit like letting clutch go slowly (but automatically) to allow abit of slip, some ppl like to refer it as auto gbox.. whatever..

nitro methane fuel, compress to liquid (or near liquid) condition before igniting. need rebuild almost after every run.

-that supercharger info i read.. above.. 8liter ohv from viper not enough to spin the blower

spark plug will melt/spoil halfway, the later part of the quater mile the engine ignite solely from the compresion and heat of piston, have to cut fuel supply to shut down engine.

forgot the figures, dunno how many thousand USD they cost to run every second ( i got shock at first, when read the facts of top fuel dragster, everysecond cost few K, if all the staff/crew work for free)

 

[synchron]

That is what it cost if you want to run your that high in hp. HP generate can fly a plane already. A second world fighter plane is about 800-1000hp only if i am not mistaken.

It depends on what you want to do with car and what type of budget that you have.

 

[TRDae92]

warr...so kin tio.....already talk till the HP can getting take off soon......ehhe:)

 

[synchron]

Haha! just comparing the engine from the old days and now adays.

 

[turbo10]

hi...i dunno.in ur case...it's up to you.u wanna quick response,go for s/c.if u wanna go for top end power and feel the sudden rush of the g force, go turbo.for me i wanna change to turbo, to have the other feel that i didn't have when i used the s/c. been driving the s/c powered car since 1997.all mod i can do i did.super oversize crank pulley (1.5 bar), sc14 mods,water/air intercooler,front mount i/c,everything..i can say u can beat some turbo cars using the 1.6 sc engine..but that is not enough.i lacks the top end power like the turbo have.but one thing for sure.i missed a lot during my sc time.it was really fun having the 'big displacement' feeling in ur car.tap the paddle sc will come into power. imagine having 0.5 bar at just 1.5 k and continues to 1.1 bar (thats the limits of toyota sc). if ur going for after market sc. go for it.it's ur call.that's my 2 sen.

 

[synchron]

If you are running airflow engine, boosting below 1 bar, u dont even have use intercooler.

Centrifugal s/c doesn't need to use intercooler because they are very efficient in supplying cool air.

 

[-e f i n i-]

would swapping the pulley for a bigger result in a higher max rpm? no?
hmm, if centrifugal uses an intercooler, wouldnt be better? more efficient?
anyway, whats the max RPM your supercharger unit can go, synchron?

 

[rollakid]

bigger puley slower engine rpm... as i know..

 

[synchron]

The supercharger max rpm is 110,000 rpm. Without the intercooler boost will come in much faster.