BOT (Bolt On Turbo)

[Wild_Seven]

My PS Fuel EnhancerII has no problem so far for almost 2 years now and according to my sifu,I don't need ignition timing control if I don't boost more than 1.5 BAR.

To each his own. To those who thinks its not necessary, you wont know what you are missing. It doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out that the ignition timing needs to be altered when you are running on boost, low or high.

Turbulent turbo mixtures burn faster than normal aspirated mixtures, but the denser mixtures also slow the burning process. Therefore, the ignition curve should be retarded slightly as boost rises and the mixture becomes both denser and turbulent. The correct ignition timing under all circumstances is achievable only IF the timing curve can be designed right along with the fuel curve.

Now with the PS Fuel Enhancer, only the fuel map can be modified, but ignition timing remains as per stock standard. Any Ali, Ah Chong and Muthusamy on the streets can tell you if wont work perfectly!!

 

[140dB]

dats y.....

this fella put in a car wif knock sensing....so ecu relearn itself......

if ur ecu smart like this ecu than can larr.....

what if ur ecu a bit stupid 1. engine knock itself to bits? heheh lets hope not larr....

btw, as discussed, as ecu gets smarter wif so may 3d maps interelated wif other 3d maps, maybe simple analog piggy is better for the casual tuner. For a tuner which knows the particular ecu program code inside out, lives, eats, sleeps that particular ECU,i feel a programmable digital system should be more accurate for maximum tuning. then comes the fully programmable ecu which almost all race teams use. wonder who makes an analog programmable ecu heheh...

regarding ign timing tuning, i selected emanage because it had that feature. however, as i tested my car, i found that even at 0.5 bar boost on a stock 9.5 CR, im running NO ignition timing retard wif NO audible knocking. This was confirmed as i read an article about how engine lose volumetric efficiency as revs climb. all due to the mass of air unable to fill the cyl at high speed. so what im trying to say is, a lot of NA cars wif small turbo's knock around 3-4krpm because the intake manifold is tuned at that rpm where the volumetric efficiency is the highest, thus even a little boost at that rpm will "overfill" the cylinders causing the combustion chamber pressure to be too high. much higher boost pressures at a higher rpm wont cause the knocking it caused at 3-4krpm. a lot of turbo kit manufacturers purposely size their turbos to be on the large side i believe because of this reason. look at the greddy integra b18c kit. it uses a td05-20g which would be considered large for a 2.0cc what more 1.8cc car.....So.....u can boost without retarding ign timing. but selection of turbo, intake manifold, max boost pressure, cams will determine if ur stock CR engine will knock.....


my 2c

 

[normality78]

140db bro,
side track abit. with you saying "a lot of NA cars wif small turbo's knock around 3-4krpm because the intake manifold is tuned at that rpm where the volumetric efficiency is the highest, thus even a little boost at that rpm will "overfill" the cylinders causing the combustion chamber pressure to be too high."

it is possible that by changing the intake manifold design to more flow type will reduce the knocking effect?

 

[140dB]

sorry normality i meant to say "a lot of hi performance NA cars ( CR of 10 or higher eg VTEC etc)...." my crap 4g13 is only 9.5cr, and so accepts low boost 0.5bar quite well. i suspect the same for 4g15.

you can detune by using a hi cam or larger turbo too. modding the intake manny is expensive, maybe as much as the cam or turbo. the good points of using a larger turbo or cam is of course the power increase at hi rpm.

intake design is not as simple as it looks.as far as i remember the equation for a 5th pulse intake length is 54000/rpm so for 4000rpm is 13.5 inches. the formula for intake diameter is much more complicated...

 

[HP Gila]

• Analog vs. Digital; which is better? Do you know modern ECU is consisted of 85% more analog circuitry than digital [in actual electricity term: these are all belong to d old school transistorized family]? The so called ‘analog’ inside the ECU are: The injection amplification, Air mass/ Map, throttle, temperature sensing n etc… all these are to ensure the engine to be able to run smoother and faster, this is also similar to our computer mouse drives by analog and not the digital type 1-0, 1-0 or 0-1 signal. Today digital production can always save a lot of space & it is cheaper to produce, but highly dependent on how fast is its resolution to give good result.

• There is no doubt some members low boost 0.5 to 0.8 bar bolt on turbo system relied on PS-PowerSport AFE-II had being proved for its good reliability & good performances for many years. This simple look gadget seems useful, and able to changes 2 – 5 degrees of ign. timing when altering the engine load signal if one tuner really understood the ECU 3D graph program. Most good tuners should agree that in some situation by injected richer fueling into the engine combustion should require more timing; but it doesn’t need to if VE improved with low force air mass.

 

[fks123]

paging for andy cheah !!

we are still waiting for some update on the UNICHIP TURBO VIOS !!!

come on.. some pictures !! at least...

 

[mokomoko]

If i setup a small turbine (say a TD04) to my 4g92 and run it at a low boost (say around 0.4 - 0.6), will i have to change anything in my engine to take the higher compression?
I was thinking of sourcing out the pipings, manifold, turbine, intercooler, a oil cooler (keep the engine running safer), and other stuff (please do advise) and then sending it to a specialist to fix everything together.

Im just wondering on the durability and fail rate of my engine after the BOT

 

[EG6SiRT?]

go seek the specialist advice that u wish to do the setup on what to buy and what not...its better that way ..so u can avoid buying things that dont match!! just my 2 cents...
itll save a lot of money though....

 

[ky_fei]

mokomoko :sum part better let those mech get e.g. turbine . unless u knows alot on turbine le, if not once failure , u ll scratch ur head and u cant bang the mechanic

oil cooler, if u planning to go slow, dat can be later job. Coz not cheap for doin piping n stuff.

Reliability and fail rate? Well, i bot my car till nw, twice gasket burn using local 1,nothing harmed.(coz local no metal 1, but nw got from thailand, ltr plannin get from RPW Australia)
and drive shaft break due to boost when cornering ( i must say its damm fun, hahaha) other than that , no problemo at all

for 4g92,market does sell metal gasket, but for 4g15 , nop =( hahahah.

 

[normality78]

yeah agreed. unless you well experinced else its not wise to buy urself. Anyway to sum up, there is no cheap way to play turbo.

 

[ky_fei]

normality : u also bot rite?

 

[normality78]

yeah....

 

[ky_fei]

wad engine ? haha maybe got sumthing in common leh. =P

 

[cipan_supercas]

for 4g92,market does sell metal gasket, but for 4g15 , nop =( hahahah.

no worries...

http://www.zerotohundred.com/newforums/showthread.php?p=1919272#post1919272

 

[normality78]

wad engine ? haha maybe got sumthing in common leh. =P

toyota engine

 

[unknown1x]

hmm 140 db, you bot on 4g13? convery go fuel injection izzit?

i was wondering if i wants to bolt in turbo.. but.. still wants to remain carburator, how could the setup be? since changing to efi + bot seems to cost more then transplant a new engine ..

please nelighten me about the setup that i might be able to do , and about the rough price about it..

 

[cheamys]

paging for andy cheah !!

we are still waiting for some update on the UNICHIP TURBO VIOS !!!

come on.. some pictures !! at least...

:Not_Impressed: Come on, you should also update your Waja turbo installation from Drager racing with PS-PowerSport management! Is there any problem with the BOT system?

 

[fks123]

:Not_Impressed: Come on, you should also update your Waja turbo installation from Drager racing with PS-PowerSport management! Is there any problem with the BOT system?

yeah ... i was about to !!! was busy driving around !! hehhehe :P

as i just got my car today !! came out of Drager Racing... second corner out...
met road block by traffic police... but they didnt even look at me... cuz my intercooler is black... and its almost invisible with the original grill... muahahahaha....

until now.. my comment is.. idling stable... pick up is responsive...
i dont dare to full boost for too long....because feels abit scary...feels like i am gonna ram something and get smashed....
i know.. dont laugh at me... i still need time to get used to it...

workmanship is excellent... boost at 0.5 bar...
so far still alright... will test it again and again....

to me... PS powersport is serving the purpose for me for now...
*fingers crossed*

 

[cheamys]

Hihi, still around la..... car still in progress of the BOT and if all things well, maybe can pick up this Saturday(Maybe ya..). I know, I know why so long, gei? Well! We're talking about Mr. Turbo Lim here, he will not release any car if he is not 100% sure thing are done right. I dont mind waiting for another week, as he promise once he handed back the car to me and after runing in the turbo. I can tekan as hard as I like guarantee no problem. I will keep you guys posted, tata....

:Not_Impressed: It seems this Vios turbo took much longer times to achieve its good performance!

:angel_smile: Congatulation to fsk123! You got a sucessful mods and you are really enjoy driving your BOT Waja now. Still cann't imagine the torque & power of your turbocharged Waja with original pistons compression pressure + 0.5 bar forced pressure? Oh! It should be excellant when compare to a stock Waja!

 

[DewA_LavaU]

hehe at last fks.I've been monitor this thread since the very first beginning (my "watchlist" thread~) and patiently watching for your progress :shades_smile: do update for any news & devt coz I'm also really2 intereted to BOT my 4G18 CS3A :) perhaps I shuld pay visit to Dragger Racing very2 soon and if lucky I might seen ur monsta on the road :_:

Cheers.:shades_smile: