2006 Malaysia

[GT3]

yup, I really enjoy watching montoya and kimi drive. not sure if "aggressive" is the correct word to describe their driving, but it sure as hell is entertaining.

alonso and schumacher...imho, is boring. they go fast, but in a bland kind of way. schumacher dont drive as he used to when he was fighting for his first championship, or when racing mika.

i agreed with u on kimi and montoya's driving style.. however i do disagree on alonso n msc.. while kimi and montoya's driving style is diff to some extend its still rather conventional (many drivers in the past has this style).. alonso hav a completely new method which frankly no one hav ever use it (the way he steer a car by exessive input to the steering).. im impressed by the creativity of him to drive a car this way.. msc however is diff.. msc is best in what he do.. create the less drama when he drive a car to the max.. he corrects everything with the steering and pedals even before the sudden (bad) changes in the car happen.. its brilliant to see it if u know what he is doing.. another driver i like but u did not mention is fisichella.. to me he is being underrated.. for example the race in msia if u look on the on board camera the way he apply the throttle while accelarating out from a corner is damn impressive.. not to mention his steering input.. its fluid and enjoying to watch..

some other drivers can do this as well.. but till now some of them doesnt seems to hav the potential to do it as good as any of the drivers i mention above.. but then again i dint really study every drivers style in detail so i cant be certain (for instance i know jenson n rubens is smooth as silk but till now i haven really go n look at it.. same with jarno as well)

 

[boggysv]

I dont really know much about driving these cars really.

to me, it seems like alonso brakes late, then struggles to fight the understeer with big steering inputs. somehow it is fast, so the effectiveness is unquestionable.

schumacher..he does everything too smooth, and as a spectator, I do not appreciate it, although the driver inside acknowledges that's good driving.

fischhella has good throttle control no doubt, but I am skeptical that it would help him improve his time by "alot" since the renaults traction control are one of the best in F1. having said so, during the race, his TC lights did blip quite a few times while coming out of corners. it might have made a lot of difference if it was during the turbo era though. (I havent been paying alot attention to him previously, since it was only during last season and this race that he got some fair amount of coverage/exposure)

btw, interesting style diiscussion
http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=80703

I have a video that expains the telemetry data of MS vs herbert's steering and throttle input at one corner, about 8mb, you want it?

 

[GT3]

I dont really know much about driving these cars really.

to me, it seems like alonso brakes late, then struggles to fight the understeer with big steering inputs. somehow it is fast, so the effectiveness is unquestionable.

schumacher..he does everything too smooth, and as a spectator, I do not appreciate it, although the driver inside acknowledges that's good driving.

fischhella has good throttle control no doubt, but I am skeptical that it would help him improve his time by "alot" since the renaults traction control are one of the best in F1. having said so, during the race, his TC lights did blip quite a few times while coming out of corners. it might have made a lot of difference if it was during the turbo era though. (I havent been paying alot attention to him previously, since it was only during last season and this race that he got some fair amount of coverage/exposure)

btw, interesting style diiscussion
http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=80703

I have a video that expains the telemetry data of MS vs herbert's steering and throttle input at one corner, about 8mb, you want it?

haha i also dunno how to drive these beast.. jus that i relate it to some of the racing theory taught to me by some professional drivers

however i do get alonso's driving style (not completely.. obviously).. to me its refreshing becoz its completely diff to the conventional driving techniques.. n like u put it its effective so i believe its workable and gave me ideas to try it on races

msc well maybe its not that spectacular but i really enjoy looking he drives.. i cant see his pedal movement obviously but by engine note roughly can guess.. i like the way he settles a car.. very very impressive

fisi throttle control might not be as useful as the time where they are no traction control but then its still nice to see such technique.. n frankly nowadays most drivers rely on the traction control so u can see the TC sign very often in other drivers lap too.. another thing that impress me with fisi is that his ability to throttle a fraction earlier than other drivers (was mentioned by mika in f1 racing last time n i was skeptical at first but now im convinced)
in short jus enjoyment to see it

oh thats cool.. where did u get the telementary?

 

[boggysv]

it's an interview/documentary conducted by bbc years ago, I'm not that well connected to get f1 telemetry . just a short clip. btw, you got pm.

 

[si|verfish]

OMG! We've got F1 geeks on board!

Kidding, very interesting dicusssion. I don't know much about the driver's individual driving styles but I must say that I've heard of Martin Brundle rave about Button's ultra smooth driving for more than half a dozen times.

 

[koolspyda]

F1 has been liken to a very, very, very fast go kart. (in simple terms)

this is from jared holstein who a mere mortal who test drove a retired renault michelin F1 last year (jared holstein=former senior editor from SCC) who i had the privileged to meet last couple of days; together with jay chen . (invited by some malaysian group for F1 weekend)

we all are fans in different drivers this year, I echo boggysv sentiments on current drivers.

 

[jiggly_head]

I think i'm not gonna put very much high hope for coming races...I really hope the silver camp will improve the overall package once they ener the europe..I had another scary moment on yesterday..I saw an accident befoe the dengkil rest house..It was a terrible jam on the way heading to USJ/Shah alam from Sepang..I think it was a kancil / kelisa car...wrecked into pieces..the traumatic part is when I pass by the car,I saw the driver stuck in the car with furious bleeding on his face...I think he's dead perhaps....Rest in Peace

yeah terrible accident. i think it just happened as i drove past as not many cars were there... i think it was a wira though engine was still smoking up when i passed it.. was in between the barriers. i figure that he's dead as his head is all smashed up.. moved.. on. and saw the typical malaysian stop beside the road to take pictures while smiling. :retarded:

 

[prodigy]

Why the fuck would someone take picture of a person half dead covered in blood? Don't they have any feelings at all. Get some help at least.

 

[GT3]

OMG! We've got F1 geeks on board!

Kidding, very interesting dicusssion. I don't know much about the driver's individual driving styles but I must say that I've heard of Martin Brundle rave about Button's ultra smooth driving for more than half a dozen times.

martin have always been a fan of jenson.. i forget if he is jenson's manager as jenson's current or ex manager has a similiar name.. anyway doesnt matter, he is about right regarding jenson.. when bar provided jenson with a relatively good car in 2004 i remember seeing his driving a few times.. although the memory was abit blur now i do remember he was smooth.. but i wasnt capable to see or identified anything special about his driving aside from super smooth.. to me its more of natural talent than technique

 

[si|verfish]

Well, his super smooth driving isn't doing him a lot of good is it? Tells you as much about driving styles. Do what you have to, just get the job done. Whether you like little jabs at the throttle, big jerks at the wheel, very late braking, whatever...just be fast and not just fast enough.

 

[GT3]

Well, his super smooth driving isn't doing him a lot of good is it? Tells you as much about driving styles. Do what you have to, just get the job done. Whether you like little jabs at the throttle, big jerks at the wheel, very late braking, whatever...just be fast and not just fast enough.

hmm i disagree.. driving style of a driver is important becoz when he can find a car that suits his style the best he could extract the potential from the car no others can.. while i conceived such situation is rare most of the time the reality bear similiarance in it.. the reason why teams spend time and resources in setting a car up is to make the car best suited for a driver.. of coz there would be times when the car jus isnt up to it n its up to the driver to really makes a diff.. thats why msc and alonso is world champions.. they at least at the moment could do the best out of the machines they have (msc hav a few legendary drive where his car was not even competitive but he still get podium or even win.. same with alonso in his earlier career b4 becoming champion last year)

again im not jenson's fan but then i do conceived he is really quick.. the cars he had over the years are jus not good enuff.. n frankly speaking no matter how good u are if u wanna beat someone at the minimum as capable as u (note: be it msc, fernando or kimi) u need a car better than them.. so far the honda isnt as good as ferrari (2004) , anyone else in 2005 and 2006 its till not as quick as the renault (plus renault has 2 damn fine drivers)

 

[prodigy]

You don't need a smooth driver to win races or championships.

David Coulthard are among some of the smoother drivers. He was quick and smooth and won some races but he is nowhere near a championship contender. In fact, if i'm not mistaken, among all 2006 drivers, he's a driver with the second most GP wins at 13 wins.

Among the champions over this decade, Michael, Mika, Alonso, Villeneuve...they were never known to be smooth drivers. They are so used to maximizing the cars potential. Driving on the limit almost every other race and wheel to wheel battles are so common during the earlier part of their career.

Button so far has not exude this kinda battling spirit, which is why i'm not surprised he's not won any races yet. While i do hope he wins some, most likely he'll end up like Jarno Trulli or Fisichella who are already veteran in the sport and only winning few grand prix in their race life.

 

[GT3]

You don't need a smooth driver to win races or championships.

David Coulthard are among some of the smoother drivers. He was quick and smooth and won some races but he is nowhere near a championship contender. In fact, if i'm not mistaken, among all 2006 drivers, he's a driver with the second most GP wins at 13 wins.

Among the champions over this decade, Michael, Mika, Alonso, Villeneuve...they were never known to be smooth drivers. They are so used to maximizing the cars potential. Driving on the limit almost every other race and wheel to wheel battles are so common during the earlier part of their career.

Button so far has not exude this kinda battling spirit, which is why i'm not surprised he's not won any races yet. While i do hope he wins some, most likely he'll end up like Jarno Trulli or Fisichella who are already veteran in the sport and only winning few grand prix in their race life.

erm ur right on certain pts n i agreed with u.. but michael is considered as one of the smoothest driver on the modern era.. his steering movement is very minimal n his pedal movement are fluid.. from the outer look the car might look abit twithcy but its normal as car that is on the limit doesnt look as stable as cars being at 90 percent.. having said so most of the time schumi's car is like on the rail.. (maybe with the exception of tight corners where he uses the pedal movement to flick the backend).. thats not the part where u judge a drivers style.. drivers style is the way he drives the car with the input he have on steering and pedals.. u could see similiar things abt the car of FA or KR when they are on the limit.. its very neat and similiar but occasionally on certain corners or certain part of corners they hav their trademark difference.. n thats due to the style

i actually don remember or know how mika drives becoz those times i dint really know how to look at drivers style.. hell i tot the main reasonthey are fast becoz their car is fast (very naive thinking i admit.. haha but that was a long time ago)..

jenson i think he is a good driver but im not sure if he is a great driver.. i don see the passion of him shown like msc, alonso, kimi or to some extend even montoya.. but i reserve judgement on the battling spirit as during races (at least the more current ones when he have a decent enuff car) he been rather aggresive with overtaking moves and stuff.. i might be wrong abt this but im not sure he will win a championship esp with the likes of FA, KR, JPM and even nico rosberg (left out schumi as i assume by the time honda have such a car michael have most likely retired.. if not jenson will hav another tough one to beat).. like u i believe he will most likely end up winning odd races like david coulthard

 

[si|verfish]

like u i believe he will most likely end up winning odd races like david coulthard

Something I've said many times. Jenson is not top drawer. He's like your Coulthards, your Barichellos, your Fisichellas.

 

[prodigy]

GT3, i kinda agree with your point about schumi too. He's such a great driver that when you look at the way he drives, he's the coolest guy on the track and he doesn't give that much steering input.

However, your points are valid when he's at the top of his game. Just look back 3 to 5 years ago when he was winning like nobody's business. He didn't even have to flex his muscles and the Ferrari's were a clear 1 second a lap faster than anyone. Most of the time, it was flag to flag win or 1-2 with RB. While saying this, he was never really challenged and most of the time he was coasting to victory while not even driving at the full potential i suspect. We saw how great his driving skills were and thats what i call a smooth driver. Lap after lap his line were so consistent. Again, i'd like to emphasize that he was never really challenged.

Look back another 7-9 years when his arch nemesis, Villeneuve, Damon Hill and Mika Hakkinen were having good cars. Most of the time, we see the wild side of Schumi. That was what i call, he was driving over the cars capability. Most of the time he started 4 or 5 and had to battle his way to the top, making lots of overtaking moves and daredevil laps which impressed everyone. That was 'not the smooth Schumi' because most of the time he was all over the back of the driver in front and kinda force them into making error. He wouldn't hestitate to go into the grass or hit an apex just to make sure he gets a tyre in front. In short, he was aggresive. Very similar to schumi, Mika Hakkinen was like what Kimi is. Extremely quick and lap after lap, he'd be trying to better his own time and doesn't stop pushing till the end of the race, even if he's a clear 50 seconds ahead at the last lap.

Also, look at least year when schumi actually had a few problems with the car. He had some graining issues and also during qualifying, he overcooked his lines and screwed up his one lap qualifying. Signs that he was trying to squeeze more out of his sucky Ferrari. That was never the 'smooth schumi'.

 

[GT3]

yea i think ur right.. frankly i couldnt comment on how schumi drove yrs ago but i did heard he was the way u describe.. however i also heard that since his start of his career he drove the way i describe (according to other teams who hired him before).. in fact thats the one thing i admired abt schumi which is he could change his style when its need to n still get quick laptimes (even enuff to beat the other faster car when the driver are not that good).. then again he doesnt hav a choice then.. like i mentioned before when a car is up to it his style will prevail becoz thats when he is the quickest

last yr actually schumi had some poor performance notably shanghai.. but most of the time even though he dint get to the podium for other races he drove very hard and very well.. he out do the car (jus look at barrichello performance in the same race).. i admit some of the time he screw up some qualifying but he was still very smooth when his performance is more normal

 

[prodigy]

Back in the younger days, he was extremely quick and daring. Won some races in only his 2nd season of F1 and he did that in a much inferior car. He was also a very wild driver with a win at all cost attitude. However, nowadays, you see the more mature Schumacher.

 

[si|verfish]

He's in his mid 30s, he should be.

Don't reply to that, it is supposed to be funny.

 

[GT3]

well another reason would be that time they don hav alonso or kimi.. mika if i dint remember wrongly dint hav the chance to get into a good car till later of his career.. plus i don think damon, jv are really a match for msc in terms of speed.. even piquet snr conceived he wasnt as quick as schumi when he was schumi's team mate.. senna well too bad he pass away early if not he might give schumacher a real challenge as well..

schumacher is as good as ever (in fact he shud be better than earlier as human improves).. but like silverfish said.. he is much more mature now..

 

[si|verfish]

And Schumacher, despite his age, is still one of the fittest if not the fittest of the drivers.