Wastegate Explained.

[evo5755]

Well, 38mm or 44mm, it depends on the wastegate spring whether it opens at 0.7 bars, 1 bars or etc... When u have everything stock, GSR turbo boost at 0.7bars. So, if you have a wastegate with 0.7 bars spring rate, they should be the same. Wastegate has a better boost consistency compare to the stock internal actuator.

So, first thing u need to find out is the spring rate of your wastegate...

Sorry i am newbie here. What is boost consistency?

How do you actually measure or justify the difference for actuator/internal wastegate vs external wastegate? What is the pro and con for the 2 items which does the same job?

 

[speed2horizon]

Sorry i am newbie here. What is boost consistency?

How do you actually measure or justify the difference for actuator/internal wastegate vs external wastegate? What is the pro and con for the 2 items which does the same job?

Boost consistency is just a term i used to describe about stability of the boost. I.e. no boost spike/fluctuation when full boost.

INTERNAL WASTEGATE

It's normally used by OEM's turbo. However, Internal wastegate is actuated by an actuator that is mounted on the turbo itself. The thing that looks like Popeye's pipe with an extended rod. As time goes by, there will be problem with actuator spring strength, diaphragm leaks and other issues. But new actuator is not easy to find and expensive, but secondhand actuator depends so much on the luck of buying... So, most of the people will prefer the external wastegate.

EXTERNAL WASTEGATE

or as the picture by sdf.

The boost is more stable due to better quality spring. And if there is anything wrong with the spring or diaphragm, those things are replaceable. Most of the ppl will have the wastepipe exposed to the environment to reduce the restriction within the exhaust piping. When external wastegate is actuated, the excess exhaust goes through the wastepipe and create sound like lorry/exhaust bocor. Some ppl call likes it. But I call it noise... Just personal preference.

However, the wastepipe can also be directed back into the main exhaust pipe unit. But will create minor performance loss that u may not even feel/realize.
And for most people, they install external wastegate is more for the "noise" and the look... But for me, i'll install it when my actuator goes to heaven...

Or maybe when i wanna upboost and boost stability is required...

 

[jinkl]

hehehe, im still looking for a inside pics of tial vs turbosmart, i know turbosmart has its advantage, bt yet to find the pics

 

[speed2horizon]

hehehe, im still looking for a inside pics of tial vs turbosmart, i know turbosmart has its advantage, bt yet to find the pics

Bro, i think we should look for the internal pictures of China/imitation wastegate and the Original wastegate so that people can differentiate and justify why go for oris....

It'll be more beneficial to everyone...

 

[turbolover]

Thanks speed2horizon for ur explanation. i kinda have a imitation tial wastegate and wondering how will i know what the spring rate rating is since no instruction manuals.
care to elaborate? My ori actuator is running fine after i got my boost meter recently after 2 yrs of driving my turbo. didn't notice any boost spike but feel itchy wanna fix the wastegate.

 

[speed2horizon]

Thanks speed2horizon for ur explanation. i kinda have a imitation tial wastegate and wondering how will i know what the spring rate rating is since no instruction manuals.
care to elaborate? My ori actuator is running fine after i got my boost meter recently after 2 yrs of driving my turbo. didn't notice any boost spike but feel itchy wanna fix the wastegate.

Miahahaha... bontot gatal ye... Actually from what I heard, the biggest problem with the imitation was the diaphragm which is made of rubber that has direct contact with the exhaust gas. Then the rubber kong kah liao... cause leakage. But i heard some of the later version Tial style uses silicon diaphragm which is more heat resistance...

The next issue about the imitation i heard was the spring will soften after use. Cause the spring material they use is also not heat resistance. Again, just like when we all started playing cars... WE chop our suspension spring for lowering, or we go for spring compression. We heat up the spring and the compress it, the the spring will deform and become shorter. Same case lor....

But imitation being imitation. We shouldn;t compare 2 similar look product that have dramatic cost difference.

But what jinkl was trying to say is the internals design of the wastegate.

 

[evo5755]

Boost consistency is just a term i used to describe about stability of the boost. I.e. no boost spike/fluctuation when full boost.

INTERNAL WASTEGATE

It's normally used by OEM's turbo. However, Internal wastegate is actuated by an actuator that is mounted on the turbo itself. The thing that looks like Popeye's pipe with an extended rod. As time goes by, there will be problem with actuator spring strength, diaphragm leaks and other issues. But new actuator is not easy to find and expensive, but secondhand actuator depends so much on the luck of buying... So, most of the people will prefer the external wastegate.

EXTERNAL WASTEGATE

or as the picture by sdf.

The boost is more stable due to better quality spring. And if there is anything wrong with the spring or diaphragm, those things are replaceable. Most of the ppl will have the wastepipe exposed to the environment to reduce the restriction within the exhaust piping. When external wastegate is actuated, the excess exhaust goes through the wastepipe and create sound like lorry/exhaust bocor. Some ppl call likes it. But I call it noise... Just personal preference.

However, the wastepipe can also be directed back into the main exhaust pipe unit. But will create minor performance loss that u may not even feel/realize.
And for most people, they install external wastegate is more for the "noise" and the look... But for me, i'll install it when my actuator goes to heaven...

Or maybe when i wanna upboost and boost stability is required...

Thanks for the information explained for everyone knowledge.

So you mentioned that with time, problem will occur to the spring and diaphragm of the actuator. the internal wastegate is made of spring inside and it controls the flap to release the exhaust gas on the turbo hotside.

Whereas for external wastegate, it comprises of spring and diaphragm too, but with exhaust gas flowing through the external wastegate itself. So i think it will be very hot.

If time goes by, if the problem occurs to the spring, does the external wastegate wear out way much faster than actuator because external wastegate has so much heat in it? Does this mean actuator is LESS reliable than external wastegate?

Just to share on this point on why people opt to change external wastegate. Of course the biggest reason is sound and look for most people. But how about the actual functionality vs the orignial actuator?

Bump:

hehehe, im still looking for a inside pics of tial vs turbosmart, i know turbosmart has its advantage, bt yet to find the pics

i am using turbosmart now. I know what is the advantage. It looks more cool, smaller, and lighter.

 

[speed2horizon]

Thanks for the information explained for everyone knowledge.

So you mentioned that with time, problem will occur to the spring and diaphragm of the actuator. the internal wastegate is made of spring inside and it controls the flap to release the exhaust gas on the turbo hotside.

Whereas for external wastegate, it comprises of spring and diaphragm too, but with exhaust gas flowing through the external wastegate itself. So i think it will be very hot.

If time goes by, if the problem occurs to the spring, does the external wastegate wear out way much faster than actuator because external wastegate has so much heat in it? Does this mean actuator is LESS reliable than external wastegate?

Just to share on this point on why people opt to change external wastegate. Of course the biggest reason is sound and look for most people. But how about the actual functionality vs the orignial actuator?

Bump:

i am using turbosmart now. I know what is the advantage. It looks more cool, smaller, and lighter.

Erm... the internals of the external wastegate designed to take heat. The price justifies... The boost stability is well controlled compare to the actuator.

Well, the actuator is uses diaphragm which i don't know what the material is. But it leaks when it's getting old. If I have time, I'll postmortem it. miahaha...

Btw, Jinkl is trying to say the design of the both wastegates' internal. Not the look and the so called lighter... =.=" give him some time to find the picture... And u'll know...

 

[evo5755]

Erm... the internals of the external wastegate designed to take heat. The price justifies... The boost stability is well controlled compare to the actuator.

Well, the actuator is uses diaphragm which i don't know what the material is. But it leaks when it's getting old. If I have time, I'll postmortem it. miahaha...

Btw, Jinkl is trying to say the design of the both wastegates' internal. Not the look and the so called lighter... =.=" give him some time to find the picture... And u'll know...

Well, i have never met any of my friends that have faulty actuator. I am also curious to know, how old is old?hehehe..Those people that always tell me boost creep or they like to say "fei boost" are either those using imitation wastegate or a few using "tulang ikan" stuff...It is good if you can post mortem your faulty actuator. then can take alook whats inside that goes faulty..

Ya i kno what jin mean. Was just trying to joke abit la..

 

[speed2horizon]

The internal wastegate consists of an flapper door that allows exhaust gas to bypass the the turbine blade, thus regulating the amount of boost created.

An external wastegate is a separate unit from the turbocharger, located on the exhaust header/manifold between the engine and the turbo. Regulating boost is done in a similar bypassing method, but is done before the exhaust gas reaches the turbochargers turbine housing.

The size of an internal wastegate is proportionate to the size of the turbo, where as an external wastegate, because it's located outside of the turbo, can be made much larger. An internal wastegate becomes too small when the volume of exhaust gasses coming from the motor exceeds the efficienct flow that the size of an internal wastegate can handle. That's when an external wastegate can be utilized, to vent the extra exhaust gasses to stabilize boost pressure.

Here's the link of ZTH members having problematic actuator. Ask tajulsan what's the outcome after shifting to external wastegate.

http://www.zerotohundred.com/newforums/tech-forced-induction/262304-turbo-actuator.html

 

[turbolover]

Ok need some clarification here.I was driving a turbocharged 4g93t with tdo5 a few years back.conversion was not done by me.It runs with a BOV and wastegate.
I also read that u guys said something about running just on wastegate without BOV.Can explain pls?Like consequences of running a wastegate with and without a BOV.:wavey:

Bump: Ok need some clarification here.I was driving a turbocharged 4g93t with tdo5 a few years back.conversion was not done by me.It runs with a BOV and wastegate.
I also read that u guys said something about running just on wastegate without BOV.Can explain pls?Like consequences of running a wastegate with and without a BOV.:wavey:

 

[jinkl]

everycar needs a internal/external wastegate, unless ur car is a n/a
everycar needs a bov , unless ur car is a diesel or n/a or antilag fitted car

hehehehe, sounds so "kurang ajar" hahahahahah

running a car without a wastegate and bov, nothing will happen unless you boost
running a car without a wastegate and bov, but your have a boost cut , you will get boost cut la bt damage your turbo
running a car without a wastegate , bov and boostcut , bye bye engine , u just blew it , u r welcome to collect your pistons from beside the road
running a car without a wastegate but with a bov, you will reach boostcut , but release air at boostcut
running a car with a wastegate but without a bov , you will reach correct boost levels , but wont release air on pedal release, damaging the turbo in long run

running a china wastegate , u get wht u pay for , but ehem, research properly, they are giving WONDERFULL warranty and CHEAP priced diapfram , so why worry ? :D , just hope u dont overboost eh

 

[speed2horizon]

Ok need some clarification here.I was driving a turbocharged 4g93t with tdo5 a few years back.conversion was not done by me.It runs with a BOV and wastegate.
I also read that u guys said something about running just on wastegate without BOV.Can explain pls?Like consequences of running a wastegate with and without a BOV.:wavey:

Bump: Ok need some clarification here.I was driving a turbocharged 4g93t with tdo5 a few years back.conversion was not done by me.It runs with a BOV and wastegate.
I also read that u guys said something about running just on wastegate without BOV.Can explain pls?Like consequences of running a wastegate with and without a BOV.:wavey:

wei wei wei... u sound bo song only....

who say use wastegate and no need to use BOV..? wastegate system is for you exhaust gas discharge purpose, a blow off valve is for the freshed compressed air discharged...

2 different system... It's like saying using intercooler and don;t use radiator... Kenot rite...?

 

[turbolover]

Heheh thank u thank u my mind very clear d like KL sky without haze.Cos i had a look at the engine setup of some cars which have wastegate but no BOV.guess they gonna have some problems in the long run la
I only know how to drive a car with a :slug: on steriods but still learning about force induction.last time i very gentle.then slowly slowly kena poison now like to force everything in.i mean air la.what u guys thinkin

 

[speed2horizon]

Maybe they are using blow in or bypass valve... Which is not so noticeable if they are stock. But i think most of the ppl having a turbo ride is for the BOV sound...

 

[turbolover]

Yup i have seen a bypass valve or a BIV as my transplanted engine come with it.I'm now using an aftermarket BIV as i heard some quarters who says that stock GSR better to use BIV.

 

[speed2horizon]

Yup i have seen a bypass valve or a BIV as my transplanted engine come with it.I'm now using an aftermarket BIV as i heard some quarters who says that stock GSR better to use BIV.

Actually for turbo charged cars with MAF sensor, it's better to use BIV as it eliminate the problem of engine stalling after blow off once a white...

However, it also reduces the sound and it recycles the air. But most of the ppl would prefer the sound... Haha...

 

[evo5755]

wei wei wei... u sound bo song only....

It's like saying using intercooler and don;t use radiator... Kenot rite...?

hahaha...this is funny hehehe..Well, maybe in general perception if got no pishh, kapishhh, ching, pish kru kru kru "sound" means no BOV la...

 

[turbolover]

Actually for turbo charged cars with MAF sensor, it's better to use BIV as it eliminate the problem of engine stalling after blow off once a white...

However, it also reduces the sound and it recycles the air. But most of the ppl would prefer the sound... Haha...

Ah got it.now choosing a bov as have been hearing the flutter from the biv long enough.hehe gatal again.

 

[-sky-]

good topic that was discussed here...

Actually for turbo charged cars with MAF sensor, it's better to use BIV as it eliminate the problem of engine stalling after blow off once a white...

However, it also reduces the sound and it recycles the air. But most of the ppl would prefer the sound... Haha...

Ah got it.now choosing a bov as have been hearing the flutter from the biv long enough.hehe gatal again.

but i wan to know the meaning of BIV here...
please explain..... thanks