BOT (Bolt On Turbo)

[140dB]

lose low end torque?

coz' the 1.6 i buying comes full set already ler... else why would i wanna have 2 turbo kits for 1 engine? hehheez... =Þ

hi alvin,
good luck in your 1.8 turbo..what fuel n spark management u planning to put in?

btw,
ive been reading one article in a car mag n saw one comparison chart for nissan 240sx ka24de wif hks turbokit c/w gt2540 bb turbo, large front mount i/cooler, evc, steel braided line, all dat good shite,6psi boost etc etc etc installed by hks demselves as demo car..the na and turbo chart shows large diff in power!

at 2krpm, na shows 50hp, turbokit 135hp!
at 5krpm, na 125hp, turbokit 225hp!!!

but thats not all to the story...

the torque charts shows a diff story.....

at 2krpm the na variant puts out 125ft/lbs(thats us imperial for us metricminded)
while the mighty hks turbo kitted ka24de puts out ~60ft/lbs (????WTF????)

at 5krpm, NA-130ft/lbs, turbo-210ft lbs (both curves fairly linear throughout that 2-5krpmrange)

looks like in this case turbo kitted NA car show big drop in low rpm torque.....will definitely feel different while driving stop go traffic right..

did any turbo kitted car feel this way?? lose power at low rpms due to exhaust inefficiency loss....

btw, i am planning to be 4g13 robot soon when got $$$ let me know what to expect in terms of drivability.

140dB

 

[alvin24]

I don't see why not... assuming they lowered the engine's compression... the torque will drop without the boost kicking in. 2krpm boost not in yet maa... still too early. =Þ

I turbo kitted with stock internals... lowered compression slightly with thicker gasket... so my torque didn't really drop in the low end... but driving it u can definitely feel the low end is not as responsive as before. The max torque doubled up compared to n/a.

 

[CSx8213x]

alvin24 ...
how much u wanna sell ur 91 turbo kits ???

140db ....
if you want to maintain your low end torque ... u can play small turbo with low boost ... so no need to change ur engine internal ... so your engine compression still the same at low end ....

 

[140dB]

HKS BOT stock ka24de

I don't see why not... assuming they lowered the engine's compression... the torque will drop without the boost kicking in. 2krpm boost not in yet maa... still too early. =Þ

I turbo kitted with stock internals... lowered compression slightly with thicker gasket... so my torque didn't really drop in the low end... but driving it u can definitely feel the low end is not as responsive as before. The max torque doubled up compared to n/a.

Hi Alvin,

When you said "not as responsive" means big drop or small? btw what size exhaust sytem were u using before bolt on and after bolt on?

The hks turbokit i mentioned, i checked the mag and confirm the engine stock. so i was surprised so much torque loss at low rpm...the article did mention a hks dual super drager exhaust but i dunno what diametre...

im now using 2" piping, 2" mid muff, 2.5" cat back, 3" tip. on 4g13. it feels shitty. dunno if bolting on trubo will f$%^ things up more.

thanks for your comments. very useful.

140dB

 

[CSx8213x]

no arr ... my car maintain stock internal ... no influence the low end power arr ....
but ... if the turbo kong ... it will influence the top end power ....

 

[140dB]

no arr ... my car maintain stock internal ... no influence the low end power arr ....
but ... if the turbo kong ... it will influence the top end power ....

hi there,

hmmmm........very interesting.
may i know where u did ur bot? or izzit sc..heheh

what size piping were u using b4 and after bot, and on what engine.
thanks alot ya


140dB

 

[CSx8213x]

piping size before turbocharge my car is 2.3" after turbocharge also maintain same 2.3".... but most of my fren say change to bigger wan will generate more power ....

using 4G93 engine .... 1.8 DOHC ..

 

[alvin24]

opps... sorry long time never check in here... =Þ

CSx8213x,
My turbo kit i selling 1.8k but still negotiable lar... i prefer to nego when buyer is serious only... sure will give good price, no worries! I'm only giving everything on the outside, cept the BOV i'll be taking back. So it includes:
- GSR manifold
- TD04HL/TD04L hybrid turbine (Serviced in march)
- eterna TT intercooler
- intercooler pipings
- steel brainded hose for turbine cooling
- 2X extra injector slots
- downpipe + flexi pipe (pineapple)

Not sure if i left out anything.... But basically its quite complete besides the BOV la... then u'll also need a boost meter and a way to tune ur fueling, and u're good to go! =Þ Ur 4G93 oso BOT liau maa... =Þ hehehe... dun play play! This turbo kit on my 4G91 boosted 170hp on wheels (still keeping the dyno), running 0.8 bar with stock internals and 1mm metal gasket.


140dB,

Me before BOT was 1.8"... after bot ran 1.8" with 0.5 bar... then later up boost 0.8bar went 2.5".... the boost was more willing to build up lar, 1.8" too small even for 0.5bar actually.
Btw, ur piping setup is too big for a 1.3 la... of coz' ur engine response everything is worse lar... not enuff back pressure. But the good news is i suppose, that if u do BOT ur engine, u most likely wouldn't have to change exhaust... this setup is just nice for a BOT 1.3... =Þ

 

[140dB]

opps... sorry long time never check in here... =Þ

CSx8213x,
My turbo kit i selling 1.8k but still negotiable lar... i prefer to nego when buyer is serious only... sure will give good price, no worries! I'm only giving everything on the outside, cept the BOV i'll be taking back. So it includes:
- GSR manifold
- TD04HL/TD04L hybrid turbine (Serviced in march)
- eterna TT intercooler
- intercooler pipings
- steel brainded hose for turbine cooling
- 2X extra injector slots
- downpipe + flexi pipe (pineapple)

Not sure if i left out anything.... But basically its quite complete besides the BOV la... then u'll also need a boost meter and a way to tune ur fueling, and u're good to go! =Þ Ur 4G93 oso BOT liau maa... =Þ hehehe... dun play play! This turbo kit on my 4G91 boosted 170hp on wheels (still keeping the dyno), running 0.8 bar with stock internals and 1mm metal gasket.


140dB,

Me before BOT was 1.8"... after bot ran 1.8" with 0.5 bar... then later up boost 0.8bar went 2.5".... the boost was more willing to build up lar, 1.8" too small even for 0.5bar actually.
Btw, ur piping setup is too big for a 1.3 la... of coz' ur engine response everything is worse lar... not enuff back pressure. But the good news is i suppose, that if u do BOT ur engine, u most likely wouldn't have to change exhaust... this setup is just nice for a BOT 1.3... =Þ

Hi Alvin,
Thanks for the reply.
Using the 1mm head gasket, did you install adjustable cam pulley as well?

140dB

 

[alvin24]

yeah... i have quite a few mods lar to my car before the turbo kit... adjustable campulleys is one of them. =Þ

But mine's DOHC so of coz' got improvements... yours is SOHC, i don't think the adjustable campulleys does much unless u get different profile cams.

 

[CSx8213x]

alvin ....
how about the extra injector and the injector controller ???
because u just give the injector slot only ... mean still need to find the injector controller myself lar ?
another thing is ... wat u mean by TD04HL or TD04L ?? mean you got two turbine to let me choose ?
I'm helping my 4G91 fren ask for it ..... hehe ...

 

[alvin24]

mine's a hybrid turbine... means that its a mixture of 2 turbines...(that joined up to be one la)... I'm using TD04HL intake housing+fin, compared to TD04L, its slightly ported. Actually wanted to take the whole TD04HL put in, but the exhaust fin pin is damaged, which is expensive to fix, so I hybrid it with my TD04L exhaust housing+fin instead.

There's many ways to control the extra injecotor... RSM shiftlight function, extra injector controller, piggy back ECUs (some can control extra injector) and also by using a standalone engine management. The slots are ready for use, in case you wanna use... if you don't wanna use just close the holes loh. I used extra injectors on the earlier stages of tuning... later on didn't use, so I just plonk in 2 injectors that aren't hooked up to anything just to close the hole la basically. HEheheez...

If your friend is serious bout buying... we can always come out and talk... I can explain all there is to know about the turbo kit... u also BOT u should be able to explain a lot to him also. =Þ I'm letting it go cheap cheap lerz...

 

[CSx8213x]

I sure i Know what i'm using in my car ....
just wonder what engine management u used last time ... why dun let go together with your turbo kit .... ?

 

[alvin24]

hahaha.... so that i can use back in my upcoming turbo kit project!

 

[chew118]

my friend got his civic with tdo4.. blow up the engine block after hitting 1.3 bar
even his has change the engine internal it still blowup anyone know why?

it start to blow when the vtec kicks in....
it is a soch 1.6

 

[alvin24]

tuning problem... send to a proper tuner for proper tuning. It probably had some pre-detonition before it blew...

 

[140dB]

adjustable campulley for sohc

yeah... i have quite a few mods lar to my car before the turbo kit... adjustable campulleys is one of them. =Þ

But mine's DOHC so of coz' got improvements... yours is SOHC, i don't think the adjustable campulleys does much unless u get different profile cams.

Hi Alvin,
Yeah exactly, my sohc engine wont benefit at all from an adjustable campulley.
But then again if i install a thicker head gasket, i hear the cam's timing would be retarded a bit and thats what i plan to use the adjustable campulley for realignment.
Anybody tell me its untrue? so i can save a bit mo money heheh


140dB

 

[alvin24]

installing a gasket doesn't effect the cam timing... it will still be the same. Most people retard the timing a bit if turbo kit... to avoid pre-detonition... correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[140dB]

installing a gasket doesn't effect the cam timing... it will still be the same. Most people retard the timing a bit if turbo kit... to avoid pre-detonition... correct me if i'm wrong.

hi again,

i found the bit of info at rpw's site:

"Due to the extra thicknesses of the gasket, you will need to use a Vernier Camshaft Sprocket as otherwise the camshaft timing will be retarded with standard camshaft gears."

I think you mistaken between cam timing and ignition (sparkplug firing) timing. yes, people sure do retard spark timing as rpm and boost increase.

140dB

 

[dolly]

you retard timing as boost increase, but advance timing as rpm increases. but since boost usually increases with rpm, you retard it.

cam timing retards when a thicker gasket is used? cool didn't know that. did they say how much it'll retard w.r.t gasket thickness?