Noticable difference using bodykits

[^pomen_GTR^]

That is so true. I have a Myvi 1.3 manual at home. That car seriously felt more responsive than my 4G15 Wira especially during lower rpm like you described. Tap a bit on the throttle and I felt the response already. Unlike 4G15 where I need to rev it to like over 3000rpm to really feel something.

So, this is how variable valve timing system are tuned nowadays. To give more torque during lower rpm while in older days, they are tuned to give more hp in higher rpm. Is that right?

There is still one more powerful modern Honda engine with i-VTEC. K20A. Around 225hp in FD2R version.

yep..nowadays hp wasnt the king anymore torque is the new king....


still the k20a missing a few ponies compared to 240hp in f20b.....and there is strong reason why honda s2000 came out with F22c... a better torque-d car than the early version f20b engine....

 

[RENESIS VIII]

yep..nowadays hp wasnt the king anymore torque is the new king....


still the k20a missing a few ponies compared to 240hp in f20b.....and there is strong reason why honda s2000 came out with F22c... a better torque-d car than the early version f20b engine....

Okay, if let's say we compare both engines one which is high on torque but with lower hp with another that is high on hp but with lower torque. Like maybe B16B VS Proton CFE... Which one will normally be the faster one in terms of acceleration and top speed? I know there are other factors like gear ratio and body weight though but let's assume these variables are the same...

Typo, should be F20C not F20B. Sure, K20A is no match for that. F20C used to hold the title as having the highest hp per litre NA engine until it is surpassed by the 458 Italia... I think F22C had higher torque but slightly lower hp than F20C....

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

Okay, if let's say we compare both engines one which is high on torque but with lower hp with another that is high on hp but with lower torque. Like maybe B16B VS Proton CFE... Which one will normally be the faster one in terms of acceleration and top speed? I know there are other factors like gear ratio and body weight though but let's assume these variables are the same...

Typo, should be F20C not F20B. Sure, K20A is no match for that. F20C used to hold the title as having the highest hp per litre NA engine until it is surpassed by the 458 Italia... I think F22C had higher torque but slightly lower hp than F20C....

i would say without special launch/rev limiter/launch control, same gearbox,same car body...

the cfe would win the acceleration race up to around 100kmh-140-or maybe up to 160kmh...later at higher speed when the wind drag would come to play...then only the higher hp b16a catching up and overtake....(assume both shift gear perfectly)


but the real advantage is in "stop n go" situation or at intermitten speed...where better torque car require less gear change....can drive at ease without change gear to accelerate again....

 

[ixeo]

yep..nowadays hp wasnt the king anymore torque is the new king....


still the k20a missing a few ponies compared to 240hp in f20b.....and there is strong reason why honda s2000 came out with F22c... a better torque-d car than the early version f20b engine....

Not exactly. Power/torque curve is king.

I give you a simple example. Why a Myvi 1.3L is nicer to drive than a Saga 1.6L? Both automatic. Because of the power curve.

Campro is high revving engine, got torque also later in the power band...but in city driving nobody revs to above 4000 rpm. So essentially it is rubbish.

The best example is Fujiwara Takumi's Formula Atlantic 4AGE AE86. When Bunta did not install the Smiths 12,000 rpm meter, Takumi did not rev to 11,000rpm, the engine did not deliver the power. Because its a race engine, its pretty crap to drive on the road, cause if you remember Takumi was thinking why his car was slower than the stock 4AGE engine.

 

[RENESIS VIII]

i would say without special launch/rev limiter/launch control, same gearbox,same car body...

the cfe would win the acceleration race up to around 100kmh-140-or maybe up to 160kmh...later at higher speed when the wind drag would come to play...then only the higher hp b16a catching up and overtake....(assume both shift gear perfectly)


but the real advantage is in "stop n go" situation or at intermitten speed...where better torque car require less gear change....can drive at ease without change gear to accelerate again....

I see... Din't expect CFE had that kind of potential because the official 0-100kmh spec for Preve CFE and Suprima S is around 9 seconds. I thought it wasn't that fast... But I guess that is due to the CVT gearbox....

Not exactly. Power/torque curve is king.

That must be the reason why many German manufacturers are making their engines to achieve peak torque in under 2000rpm...

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

Not exactly. Power/torque curve is king.

I give you a simple example. Why a Myvi 1.3L is nicer to drive than a Saga 1.6L? Both automatic. Because of the power curve.

Campro is high revving engine, got torque also later in the power band...but in city driving nobody revs to above 4000 rpm. So essentially it is rubbish.

The best example is Fujiwara Takumi's Formula Atlantic 4AGE AE86. When Bunta did not install the Smiths 12,000 rpm meter, Takumi did not rev to 11,000rpm, the engine did not deliver the power. Because its a race engine, its pretty crap to drive on the road, cause if you remember Takumi was thinking why his car was slower than the stock 4AGE engine.

ya ya...to be exact: "area under the curve"

I see... Din't expect CFE had that kind of potential because the official 0-100kmh spec for Preve CFE and Suprima S is around 9 seconds. I thought it wasn't that fast... But I guess that is due to the CVT gearbox....


cvt is power robbing....
That must be the reason why many German manufacturers are making their engines to achieve peak torque in under 2000rpm...

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

last time post mostly share their diy, or car's project or asking for help and opinion.. now is

"I wanna buy GTR or Ferrari, i got plenty of cash bitch, which one the best, money is not a problem" or "my father is fucking rich wanna buy me a supercar, which one should i buy and make those chick laid on me".. that makes some negativity here, at least i feel when i click into those thread, or is it only me feel that?

Some migrated from LYN kopitiam forum that's why....I see also lazy to go in or and feel like asking them to go back to LYN

i wouldnt say lethargic much....

but if take example of k3-ve engine rolling at around 1500rpm and slam WOT on 2nd or 3rd gear, u will feel the torque of dvvt/vvt pulling away......

now take the good old stock b16a engine and do the same...roll on 2nd/3rd at 1500rpm and slam WOT.....u will get acceleration but much slower acceleration atleast untill above 3500rpm and even more gforce/torque/hp spike when vtec activated higher up.....

thats why nowadays manufaturer design cam phase/changing/vvt/vtec/mivec/cps/vanos for better low rpm driveability instead of pure power like the good old 80s~90s.....even honda vtec now not chasing pure power and design engine for better overall driveability....i think the last gen of honda chasing pure power from their engine is the F20B S2000 engine.......even that most car tester complaint got no torque at low down rpm...

Ya, me love cars with more torque nowadays...if only can afford masuk Storia 1000cc engine into kelisa or K3VE NA and some mods to improve the torque...that would be real fun to drive....

Unless if u travel highway most of the time then HP might the thing that he/she needs.

 

[vr2turbo]

Some migrated from LYN kopitiam forum that's why....I see also lazy to go in or and feel like asking them to go back to LYN



Ya, me love cars with more torque nowadays...if only can afford masuk Storia 1000cc engine into kelisa or K3VE NA and some mods to improve the torque...that would be real fun to drive....

Unless if u travel highway most of the time then HP might the thing that he/she needs.

I thought you still in LYN.....hhahhahahhaha

VR got torque, if not Scooby doo even more......

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

I thought you still in LYN.....hhahhahahhaha

VR got torque, if not Scooby doo even more......

Nth much to read or do there. If go LYN also read up Saga Group Thread only.

 

[RENESIS VIII]

I thought you still in LYN.....hhahhahahhaha

VR got torque, if not Scooby doo even more......

I thought Subaru's flat 4 is always famous for having high torque? Their late versions of EJ20 turbo have over 400nm torque in a 2 litre engine.... Slightly more than what Evo have in 4G63T and 4B11T...(not talking about the FQ400 version here)

Nth much to read or do there. If go LYN also read up Saga Group Thread only.

I din't join LYN but from what I can see, they have all sorts of topics about almost everything right?

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

I thought Subaru's flat 4 is always famous for having high torque? Their late versions of EJ20 turbo have over 400nm torque in a 2 litre engine.... Slightly more than what Evo have in 4G63T and 4B11T...(not talking about the FQ400 version here)



I din't join LYN but from what I can see, they have all sorts of topics about almost everything right?

Ya u can find all sort of nonsensical thread there...Like How to masturbate, how to make girl love you, how to bla bla bla...

Anyway, we are straying away from Bodykit Topic...back to topic

Anyone know where can do wind tunnel test? I heard from a friend they say in Sunway have...

 

[RENESIS VIII]

Ya u can find all sort of nonsensical thread there...Like How to masturbate, how to make girl love you, how to bla bla bla...

Anyway, we are straying away from Bodykit Topic...back to topic

Anyone know where can do wind tunnel test? I heard from a friend they say in Sunway have...

Seems a lot of bull crap threads over there... I've only seen before car threads, pc threads, video games, model kits and tamiya mini 4wd thread over there. Din't join since everything can be viewed publicly even for non members.

Yeah, we're straying away as usual.

You plan to do wind tunnel test? Din't know Sunway have such a high tech facility.

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

Seems a lot of bull crap threads over there... I've only seen before car threads, pc threads, video games, model kits and tamiya mini 4wd thread over there. Din't join since everything can be viewed publicly even for non members.

Yeah, we're straying away as usual.

You plan to do wind tunnel test? Din't know Sunway have such a high tech facility.

I dont think is gonna be any cheaper than doing dyno but if can do, is also good to know your car's aerodynamic. Then see what works and what doesnt and where to improve on aerodynamics of the car. At least if got wind tunnel test then we can know what bodykit design to fit.

 

[vr2turbo]

I thought Subaru's flat 4 is always famous for having high torque? Their late versions of EJ20 turbo have over 400nm torque in a 2 litre engine.... Slightly more than what Evo have in 4G63T and 4B11T...(not talking about the FQ400 version here)



I din't join LYN but from what I can see, they have all sorts of topics about almost everything right?

Yup, that is why I mentioned even more....

To me that place is pasar, buy and sell only...

---------- Post added at 12:11 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 12:09 PM ----------

Ya u can find all sort of nonsensical thread there...Like How to masturbate, how to make girl love you, how to bla bla bla...

Anyway, we are straying away from Bodykit Topic...back to topic

Anyone know where can do wind tunnel test? I heard from a friend they say in Sunway have...

Wing tunnel for your body kit. Come lets DIY. Stick paper strips all over, I can supply table fan......hhahahhahahhahahahha

 

[RENESIS VIII]

I dont think is gonna be any cheaper than doing dyno but if can do, is also good to know your car's aerodynamic. Then see what works and what doesnt and where to improve on aerodynamics of the car. At least if got wind tunnel test then we can know what bodykit design to fit.

Do post out the results and your experience about it if you really go for the wind tunnel test.

Yup, that is why I mentioned even more....

To me that place is pasar, buy and sell only...

---------- Post added at 12:11 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 12:09 PM ----------



Wing tunnel for your body kit. Come lets DIY. Stick paper strips all over, I can supply table fan......hhahahhahahhahahahha

Yeah, I've heard before about many people selling things over there. A lot of good deals there?

Stick paper later become like that Ford Telstar spoiler story that you told before.

 

[vr2turbo]

Yeah, I've heard before about many people selling things over there. A lot of good deals there?

Stick paper later become like that Ford Telstar spoiler story that you told before.

Stick paper strips to see the wind effect, when on the fan. Not stick and use.....lol

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

Yup, that is why I mentioned even more....

To me that place is pasar, buy and sell only...

Wing tunnel for your body kit. Come lets DIY. Stick paper strips all over, I can supply table fan......hhahahhahahhahahahha

U need a huge fan. Stick those paper is a good idea but u need a really really big table fan

Do post out the results and your experience about it if you really go for the wind tunnel test.

Yeah, I've heard before about many people selling things over there. A lot of good deals there?

Stick paper later become like that Ford Telstar spoiler story that you told before.

If only got such Wind Tunnel test in Malaysia only see how. Maybe will ask my friend again for the exact name of the shop and location since he plan to mod his FN2R into a monster with widebodykit...

 

[RENESIS VIII]

Stick paper strips to see the wind effect, when on the fan. Not stick and use.....lol

LOL, I think I got your meaning wrong earlier. Sorry

U need a huge fan. Stick those paper is a good idea but u need a really really big table fan



If only got such Wind Tunnel test in Malaysia only see how. Maybe will ask my friend again for the exact name of the shop and location since he plan to mod his FN2R into a monster with widebodykit...

You need a really big facility to have a full fledged wind tunnel testing ground... Or maybe it is just some mini wind tunnel inside a workshop or something.

Off topic a bit, FN2R cannot win FD2R in terms of performance. But I can't deny that FN2R does have that cool look with that spaceship looking dashboard while FD2R just look like the common Civic to those with untrained eyes.

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

I thought Subaru's flat 4 is always famous for having high torque? Their late versions of EJ20 turbo have over 400nm torque in a 2 litre engine.... Slightly more than what Evo have in 4G63T and 4B11T...(not talking about the FQ400 version here)



I din't join LYN but from what I can see, they have all sorts of topics about almost everything right?

I thought you still in LYN.....hhahhahahhaha

VR got torque, if not Scooby doo even more......

ej got massive torque....but not as low as most street tuned car....normally around 3k rpm above will the massive torque arrive mashing u to the seat...


but below 3k rpm i prefer NA engine torque and response....

 

[RENESIS VIII]

ej got massive torque....but not as low as most street tuned car....normally around 3k rpm above will the massive torque arrive mashing u to the seat...


but below 3k rpm i prefer NA engine torque and response....

That means if you keep it to below 3k rpm during driving, then the car won't surprise you with it's sudden acceleration and power? If that is the case, then it should make city driving easier. Imagine if during traffic jam and the car suddenly jumps forward when you release the clutch a bit too early...