Cefiro Club

[GaryA32]

ong.. can pm me the hot bit price ar ?? :) u want to go for titan ar?

 

[ongteckweng]

ong.. can pm me the hot bit price ar ?? :) u want to go for titan ar?

hehe...u have pm...yeap...

 

[dre_clanz]

Hello guys..

Anybody know how much a31 skyline bodykit.
Thanks

 

[ongteckweng]

bro dre....try asking from ppl in drift.com.my...they r more a31 kakis...

gary....sorry mate...just sold the hotbits to defcon...at first was thinking about Titan...but now might opt for Eibach prokit with kayaba abs as my wife is driving the car more often than me...so its suits her better...u knowla...lady drivers....but i believe i am goin to miss the ride...:(

maybe an evo will offset that feeling....

 

[defcon1]

Heh...me using Titan Procut right now...

Richard, the boss of T said,I

 

[ongteckweng]

Heh...me using Titan Procut right now...

Richard, the boss of T said,I

tmr ppl will upgrade liow...

 

[defcon1]

tmr ppl will upgrade liow...

Actually...that message was incomplete...

Was in the middle of typing it from the office when I had to see to something and forgot about it...

Was about to say...me using Titan Pro-cut right now...

Richard, the boss of Titan, is a pro...and he decided to cut my springs...

But actually, I cut them simply to test my theory that the current profile of the A32 was not what the designers intended, and what shifting the weight distribution of the car will do for the handling. Lowered the front by about 2".

Conclusion :

a) More positive steering feel and response.
b) Marginally better turning radius...about a foot smaller circle.
c) Better interior stability at the driver seat level...means rather than getting thrown around when you corner hard, you tend to rotate around the vertical axis through the centre of gravity of the car.
d) Funny squeeks and klanks when you climb multi-level car parks - obviously not an improvement, hence, my decision to get rid of the pro-cuts. Can be eliminated if you can find the appropriate spring spacer, but those are not easy to get.

...all in all, a successful test of how changing the profile of the car marginally will affect the overall handling. Also, slightly softer "wind" noise at higher speeds...which reinforces my belief that the profile should be as I had adjusted it. Softer wind noise means that the aerodynamics of the car and the exterior accessories were optimized.

As for the Hotbits set I bought from Ong...one word of caution as I think I have analyzed the reason Ong was getting such a harsh ride in his feilo.

The hotbits adjustables are semi-race height adjustable shocks. Certainly not meant for the track...they would never survive a full race. Also, SPEEDWORKS has NO R & D facility...so they simply acquire what looks good to sell in the local market. They are simple traders who have managed to hoodwink most people into believing that they really know what they are talking about...mostly because one of the shareholders happened to be a local race driver before. Unfortunately, if we were to equate the sport of racing to the soccer field...the real brains behind the team is the coach...whereas the player/driver is simply the one who takes the bows and goes,"I just give my hundred percent...duh!".

There are a few issues with the hotbits set...

a) Springs are much more aggressive than the oem springs. This in itself is not bad...if they are matched against shocks that have the correct damping properties.

b) Hotbits shocks - typical of Japanese race shock design, the valves tend to hold for a split second before opening up. It could be that the viscosity of the oil inside is a tad thicker than prescribed for normal street use. Or the valve design is lacking.

Hence, on smooth terrain, they will work well going into and out of corners. BUT when faced with a rough surface, with a high frequency of bumps and holes, they will tend to be very harsh...the bumps and holes passing before the damper has a chance to act. I used to have a similar effect on my GAB's (real Japanese GABs, assembled to my specs, and couriered in for me.

These types of absorbers tend to rely on the initial damping effects of the tyres to minimize the harshness of the ride.

With Ong's 18" rims...and the accompanying "rubber bands", plus his high tyre pressure of 35 psi (to protect the rims)...one can only ask,"WHAT initial damping effect?"...

So, if you are using any bigger than 16" rims, and 45 series tyres...with a tyre pressure of no higher than 30 - 32 psi ...forget about the hotbits set and any other race/semi-race type adjustables. Just get an Eibach Pro-Kit...or get Titan to make you a "comfort" set of shocks...though I would consider this a waste since I believe that the pro-kit would get you an equivalent ride at a fraction of the cost.

 

[Lawcc]

As for the Hotbits set I bought from Ong...one word of caution as I think I have analyzed the reason Ong was getting such a harsh ride in his feilo.

So are you using Hotbits now? How is it to your ride? I thought you are on Titan liaw.

 

[ongteckweng]

okie chris...i know whats the prob now...so i guess downgrading to prokit with ur tokico should be better than now...

no point having a nice car with bad ride...my parents n wife have been complaining since day 1 but honestly...im happy with it....

 

[ongteckweng]

So are you using Hotbits now? How is it to your ride? I thought you are on Titan liaw.

law...havent chance yet...goin to do it today...

and yes, chris is on TITAN PRO-CUT!!! hehe

 

[Lawcc]

law...havent chance yet...goin to do it today...

I am sure you won't be happy with that. Imagine from superhard(Hotbits) to supersoft(Eibach + Tokico) now....

May be FREE swap soft Tokico to hard Kayaba a better compromise leh...hahahaha.....

 

[defcon1]

I am sure you won't be happy with that. Imagine from superhard(Hotbits) to supersoft(Eibach + Tokico) now....

May be FREE swap soft Tokico to hard Kayaba a better compromise leh...hahahaha.....

Careful...must first determine if the Eibachs are of the correct spring rate to accomodate the Kayaba. Otherwise, you get the same harsh effect WITHOUT the handling...

 

[ongteckweng]

ok...just had the Eibach prokit installed with defcon's tokiyo abs...initial feeling was gr8...i can feel the car its more comfortable comparing to my hotbits. what chris said its true...with my 18"...the ride quality really sucks...

tested his ride with hotbits n 215/55/16 series tyres...i would say wow! so comfortable...n yes the handling its there. hmm...time for another new set of rims...

back to my prokit...the ride its much more better now and im surprised that the cornering its much more refined now...i would say more control compare to my hotbits...i can feel the steering where its going.

btw, chris...ah lee its really friendly n reasonable...he charged me rm40 for the workmanship to change abs+spring (which its really really really cheap!!!) and rm18 for alignment..i am going to send my car to change all the lower arm bushes as he noticed most of them r goner. no wonder the ride quality suck big time. its totally different thing when i tested ur car...now i know why my car its so noisy.

conclusion...if u r looking for adjustables...dont use low profiles tyres + big rim...

 

[Lawcc]

btw, chris...ah lee its really friendly n reasonable...he charged me rm40 for the workmanship to change abs+spring (which its really really really cheap!!!) and rm18 for alignment..i am going to send my car to change all the lower arm bushes as he noticed most of them r goner.

Hi Ong, nice to hear that....

So where is ah lee's shop. Interested to go there also. To change Kayaba into my suspected spoilt front original absorbers. Not sure the effect leh....Hopefully not so harsh lahhah...

And do alignment as well. My current alignment guy wanted to chop him already. Con me to buy 2 cambers nuts.

 

[defcon1]

Hi Ong, nice to hear that....

So where is ah lee's shop. Interested to go there also. To change Kayaba into my suspected spoilt front original absorbers. Not sure the effect leh....Hopefully not so harsh lahhah...

And do alignment as well. My current alignment guy wanted to chop him already. Con me to buy 2 cambers nuts.

Your ride is harsh with your original OEM absorbers? Hmmmm....

I think your tokikos are flat...no more pressure or oil...so you're just riding on the pistons and springs... :)

Ah Lee's shop is in the USJ 9 Commercial Center next door to Taipan. If you wanna go there, I live in USJ 9...walking distance from his shop. Give me a call and I'll talk you in.

 

[defcon1]

Defcon'1 Take on Hotbits Adjustables...

Ok...I'll try to keep this short...

Hotbits Adjustables - YAY!!!

Speedworks - Bleeecccchhhhhh!!!!

So I hope that you have gained a keen insight into Hotbits Adjustables and their potential...

 

[nlexis]

hi defcon1, u must intro me to ah lee's place...wana do some adjustments to my koni sus

 

[nlexis]

by the way, has anyone done soundproof to the cefiro. i found that tire noisy abit

 

[Pckk]

HI Ong,
How much u get the eibach pro-kit ?

 

[defcon1]

Defcon's Take on Hotbits Adjustables...

A-HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!

...just kidding...

Here's the REAL take...

When I asked Lee to swop the absorbers and springs, I also asked him NOT to change the settings as I wanted to see what Speedworks had done to the installation as I was too busy on Friday to stick around and watch what was happening.

Anyway, I got back home from a loooooong day at work at almost midnight. In the spirit of a true modder...I got into my car and took it for a spin..

Within 100 metres of my front gate, a strange thought began to form in my mind...

Superman and OngTeckWeng have something in common...

...they both have asses of steel...

Good God! Another 100m further, I began to miss my oem shocks and procuts...

Another half a kilometre further on, I REALLY began to miss my oem shocks and procuts...clunks and all...

So...next morning, Saturday...bright and early...which, believe me, is NOT my favourite time of a Saturday, I started making my way to haunt Mr. Lee...the only man within strike range with the correct equipment to help me find out what was wrong!

Now, the CORRECT EQUIPMENT basically consists of a jack to hoist the car high enough to get my "Incredible Bulk" under it to inspect the installation. So, here's what I find...

Right lower arm - broken bushings...explains the occassional clunk, donk and thunk I hear when going over rough roads...but not the reason for my aching ass and lower back. Anyway, got them fixed...took about 3 hours as the lower arms had to be sent to a machine shop to have the bushings pressed out and new ones pressed in...

I then decide to inspect the coilovers installation. No problems there. Lee knows what he is doing. All bolts, nuts etc. properly installed.

So, the problem has to be in the coilovers itself. Inspecting the coilovers, I then notice something not quite right. When the car is hoisted up, naturally, the weight is taken off all the wheels allowing the shocks to extend to their maximum length. With all the shocks at their max length, I notice that the springs are hanging loosely between their upper and lower supports. In fact, in the case of the rear springs...there is a whole 2" of freeplay between the end of the springs and the upper plate. This is unacceptable, as a couple of things can happen...

a) When the car leaves the ground, i.e. at high speeds at a apex of a slope, the spring will drop down, allowing the "lock" between the spring upper bushing and the upper support to go off position. When the car's weight settles down again, they might not sit properly into the upper support, and the car can settle about a cm higher than it was originally. So, loose springs...are a no-no!

b) The extremely far down lower support also allows the weight of the car to almost compress the shock completely, thereby reducing the "travel' to approximately an inch either way...which means...virtually NO damping.

Conclusion : With the shocks in the extreme compressed position, the car is basically travelling on springs, and a hard, metal rod which is what the shock is at this point.

The right way...

There is no secret to determining the correct optimal ride height of a set of adjustable coilovers. These hotbits are street spec'ed, and not race. So, the profile shold be reasonably mild, rather than flat out lowered.

Before you fit on a set of height adjustable coilovers, be sure to tighten the lower support rings so that they grip the spring firmly. Then, just give them another 2 complete turns or so (for hotbits, each turn represents 1.7mm of height adjustment) to provide the springs with just a slight pre-compression to firm up the structure. On the top of the springs, there should be an aluminium or nylon bushing that should sit and lock into the upper support. Be sure that this sits properly and firmly.

Then fit on the shocks. Once fitted, with the car still on jacks, there should be NO freeplay in the springs. Drop the car and measure the height at each wheel. This would now be the optimal ride height of the coilovers. Contrary to popular belief, allowing free-play in the springs does not lower the car any further than this setting, as your shocks will only compress so far. Fine tune the height at each wheel to your specific requirements. Lock the settings and take her for a spin.

In my case, I set the rear wheel height to 27", and the fronts to 26.4". This gives the cefiro a very slightly agressive profile.

The Verdict...

Finally...the moment of reckoning. I slowly back my cefiro out of Lee's shop, aim my weapon of choice down the road, and... "Let 'Er Rip!!!"...

On the straight, the ride was firm, very slightly bumpy, but that was to be expected. However, the very slight bumps were hardly noticeable, and tended to even out the faster I went. All shocks now were definitely damping. There was no more harshness in the feel, and now, I could truly say that these were a set of performance shocks. MY ASS WAS SAVED!!!

Approaching the first traffic light, I decided to excute a high speed turn, risking what 0123 calls a "drift", i.e. losing all traction and having your car spin completely out of control...

Entering the corner, I chose the most agressive line I can. I feel the car's weight shift as it sits into the turn and completes it smoothly, with hardly any body roll. The feel is one of complete control, something I have not felt since I first got the feilo.

For about 15 minutes, I continued to run the car through it's paces. Right turns, left turns, rough roads, smooth roads, straights, smooth curves, sudden slow-downs etc. The car car passes each test like a champion and appears even more responsive, since the harder shocks and springs allows for better steering response.

The Final Word...

Whilst I was very happy with the overall performance of the hotbits adjustables, not everybody is blessed with an ass as big and shock absorbing as mine. The hotbits definitely provides improvements in control and handling. They also lower the car by about 1.5" all round, and at the optimum, sits at about the same height as the Eibach Prokit (marginally lower in front).

However, you have to expect at least a little bit of bumpiness. Another side effect is that you will feel your engine marginally through the floorboards, which is something I actually like since it allows me to "read" the engine as I drive.

BUT...I would be extremely reluctant to have Speedworks tune them for me. The only thing I have ever been impressed with about them is the SPEED at which they can swipe your mastercard as they install something that should actually WORK, but doesn't cos they botched up the job!

Next T/T, you guys can test drive to see if you like it...