Spring Rate & Damping

[Izso]

Agree! And finally LWW comes out to play! Where you've been man?

Speaking of springs that come with coilovers, for some reason AR Racing/BC Racing both give 5k front and 5k rear springs for the Sylphy. But to be fair the coilovers were meant for the Nissan Tilda aka Latio. So perhaps the 5k + 5k combi is meant for the lighter Nissan.

I'm currently on coilovers and I opted to forgo the ridiculous 5k+5k combi and go for 8k front 6k rear on my heavy Sylphy. The springs are preloaded just right to be neutral when compressed (I don't know how to explain this better, I know that wasn't the right terminology) and right now the rear is perfect with just 9 clicks of the damper (max 30) for comfort. It's in fact comparable with stock. The front however, it's a little more of a problem. 8k with the current pre-load is making it very fast to respond so whenever I go over speed bumps (slowly) I can feel the front reacting much faster than the rear, so much so if I were go to a tad bit faster the front would give me a bone jarring thud.

Front dampers set to 10 clicks btw. Any softer than 9/10 clicks then you'll get rebound from the spring when going over speed bumps and undulations which is seriously irritating. I suspect the springs are too hard for the car (I'm not looking to go racing with them) so I'm going to first play with the pre-load again, compress the springs a little more and see how that goes. That was my installers suggestion anyway. Personally I think increasing the pre-load will make it even more jarring but my installer is insisting to try first. So I will. Before lastly resorting to changing to 6k springs.

Speaking of which - why aren't there any 7k springs ah?

 

[vr2turbo]

Speaking of which - why aren't there any 7k springs ah?

To many sizes, production cost over sales volume?:hmmmm:

 

[marv3]

Usually most coilovers have stiffer spring rates in the front as mentioned = engine weight. Don't forget that your suspension besides controlling roll in corners, it keeps the car from diving and squatting under braking and acceleration too.

But having 'right' spring rates & length is a seriously long topic. You have to factor in road condition, your spring rates, length, travel, motion ratio, weight bias of the car, overall weight of the car, it's quite tricky honestly.

Some people prefer their cars to oversteer slightly so they can tighten their line in a corner, some prefer it to understeer slightly as a safety margin, and then there are some where they like it neutral. No matter how 'good' your suspension is, learning how to drive properly is always a better investment than just buying parts and hoping the car gets better. I used to think by adding more suspension bits and pieces on my car, it'll behave better. In the end it became trickier because whenever I changed something, it changed the overall balance and feel of my car at the limit. If I wasn't happy with how the car felt, I had to redo my setup to fit my driving style all over again. The only thing I haven't done yet are reinforcement bars because I want to feel how my stock chassis copes with all the suspension changes.

Personally, I feel why coilovers here have a stereotypical 6kg/mm and 4kg/mm spring rate is because they're a decent compromise between handling and comfort. Like what Ixeo says. 99% of people have no idea what the heck they're doing when they see technical data from suspension, and that's myself included. I've been just meddling around with my suspension to see what happens when I change a certain adjustment. Reading the theory behind what i'm doing helps haha.

BC V1's are nice for daily usage, though personally the BR's feel nicer. The internals of both are different, V1's being the lower end stuff. I'm using a set of V1's myself, but with horribly mismatched damping & springs. With the original springs that came with it, it was pretty nice except I had to fettle around with the rear preload of the springs. They were wound too tight from the factory.

Thanks for the explanation and feedbacks on BC. Very informative.

Just a quick one, when you say the BC V1 are nice for daily use, does it mean that it cannot perform as well as the BR? Or lets say the adjustability is not as good as BC? So can you take the V1 to track (although i wont go often) or touge?

Agree! And finally LWW comes out to play! Where you've been man?

Speaking of springs that come with coilovers, for some reason AR Racing/BC Racing both give 5k front and 5k rear springs for the Sylphy. But to be fair the coilovers were meant for the Nissan Tilda aka Latio. So perhaps the 5k + 5k combi is meant for the lighter Nissan.

I'm currently on coilovers and I opted to forgo the ridiculous 5k+5k combi and go for 8k front 6k rear on my heavy Sylphy. The springs are preloaded just right to be neutral when compressed (I don't know how to explain this better, I know that wasn't the right terminology) and right now the rear is perfect with just 9 clicks of the damper (max 30) for comfort. It's in fact comparable with stock. The front however, it's a little more of a problem. 8k with the current pre-load is making it very fast to respond so whenever I go over speed bumps (slowly) I can feel the front reacting much faster than the rear, so much so if I were go to a tad bit faster the front would give me a bone jarring thud.

Front dampers set to 10 clicks btw. Any softer than 9/10 clicks then you'll get rebound from the spring when going over speed bumps and undulations which is seriously irritating. I suspect the springs are too hard for the car (I'm not looking to go racing with them) so I'm going to first play with the pre-load again, compress the springs a little more and see how that goes. That was my installers suggestion anyway. Personally I think increasing the pre-load will make it even more jarring but my installer is insisting to try first. So I will. Before lastly resorting to changing to 6k springs.

Speaking of which - why aren't there any 7k springs ah?

Izso. Does that mean for my car size and weight, i should not go for 6kg/4kg? Go for something higher like your 8kg/6kg? Coz my car is definitely heavier than the Slyphy. Thanks bud.....

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

Agree! And finally LWW comes out to play! Where you've been man?

Speaking of springs that come with coilovers, for some reason AR Racing/BC Racing both give 5k front and 5k rear springs for the Sylphy. But to be fair the coilovers were meant for the Nissan Tilda aka Latio. So perhaps the 5k + 5k combi is meant for the lighter Nissan.

I'm currently on coilovers and I opted to forgo the ridiculous 5k+5k combi and go for 8k front 6k rear on my heavy Sylphy. The springs are preloaded just right to be neutral when compressed (I don't know how to explain this better, I know that wasn't the right terminology) and right now the rear is perfect with just 9 clicks of the damper (max 30) for comfort. It's in fact comparable with stock. The front however, it's a little more of a problem. 8k with the current pre-load is making it very fast to respond so whenever I go over speed bumps (slowly) I can feel the front reacting much faster than the rear, so much so if I were go to a tad bit faster the front would give me a bone jarring thud.

Front dampers set to 10 clicks btw. Any softer than 9/10 clicks then you'll get rebound from the spring when going over speed bumps and undulations which is seriously irritating. I suspect the springs are too hard for the car (I'm not looking to go racing with them) so I'm going to first play with the pre-load again, compress the springs a little more and see how that goes. That was my installers suggestion anyway. Personally I think increasing the pre-load will make it even more jarring but my installer is insisting to try first. So I will. Before lastly resorting to changing to 6k springs.

Speaking of which - why aren't there any 7k springs ah?

eh..got la 7k springs...my tein on scooby use 7k front, 5k rear...

while my 1.6sohc auto satria starts on 8k front, 4k rear, then when i installed fender brace, change into 6k front, 4k rear..and with not so recent 4point front strutbar,arb front and rear upgrade, i switched to 4k front,3k rear.... i wish last time i opted for hlsh type to adjust the damping as well....

Thanks for the explanation and feedbacks on BC. Very informative.

Just a quick one, when you say the BC V1 are nice for daily use, does it mean that it cannot perform as well as the BR? Or lets say the adjustability is not as good as BC? So can you take the V1 to track (although i wont go often) or touge?

Izso. Does that mean for my car size and weight, i should not go for 6kg/4kg? Go for something higher like your 8kg/6kg? Coz my car is definitely heavier than the Slyphy. Thanks bud.....

since adjustable suspension usually have firmer damping than oem absorber..best not to choose spring far stiffer than oem spring rate....i believe 6k front and 4k rear already close to stock spring rate for your car....use that first, then adjust the damping to compliment the spring and see if its still too stiff/too soft (play with damping first with not too stiff spring)....

if u want harder suspension but maxed damping setting still not hard enough...then only upgrade into stiffer spring....


same case when u already set to softest damping setting but still the car felt too hard, downgrade the spring rate.....

 

[vr2turbo]

eh..got la 7k springs...my tein on scooby use 7k front, 5k rear...

Probably different brand don't have....:hmmmm:

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

Probably different brand don't have....:hmmmm:

since plenty or adjustable suspension manufacturer from top range to bottom range....most use similar spring dimension/rating/category method....

so many of them interchangeable be it d2/improve/gab/hwl etc etc mostly can interchange the spring without no mods at all...

only things i knew that tein use bigger front coilling compared to rear (and the rest of adjustable manufacturer) (its about 10mm in spring coilling diameter..not the coil thickness size but the spring dimension when viewed from top)


but tein rear matches well with many aftermarket adjustable spring....



just maybe colour preferences not match owner

 

[KenDiriwan]

Go for FTuned Racing. Like TitanRev. Even he go on track, they have service to help you adjust according to the tracks you race on. They come to the track. Is like having a pit crew. So nice service xD

In my case, Farouk offered to give me a ride around Sepang, showing how to tackle chicane. For i did not even purchase from him, but introduced buddies to their product. I guess you can say part of marketing but damn you bet their coilover performance superb.

 

[vr2turbo]

since plenty or adjustable suspension manufacturer from top range to bottom range....most use similar spring dimension/rating/category method....

so many of them interchangeable be it d2/improve/gab/hwl etc etc mostly can interchange the spring without no mods at all...

only things i knew that tein use bigger front coilling compared to rear (and the rest of adjustable manufacturer) (its about 10mm in spring coilling diameter..not the coil thickness size but the spring dimension when viewed from top)


but tein rear matches well with many aftermarket adjustable spring....

just maybe colour preferences not match owner

ACE or any hardware shop got can spray mah!......hhahhahahhahaha

---------- Post added at 08:45 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 08:44 PM ----------

In my case, Farouk offered to give me a ride around Sepang, showing how to tackle chicane. For i did not even purchase from him, but introduced buddies to their product. I guess you can say part of marketing but damn you bet their coilover performance superb.

The power of poison......

 

[Izso]

Izso. Does that mean for my car size and weight, i should not go for 6kg/4kg? Go for something higher like your 8kg/6kg? Coz my car is definitely heavier than the Slyphy. Thanks bud.....

I wouldn't go too hard. My current setup 8k front 5k rear, I personally feel front is too jarring. Whereas the rear is firm but not stiff (if that makes sense). I think you need to have a sit in my car the understand what I mean. Personally I'd suggest you go for softer. 7k 5k perhaps.

Next TT you sit my car and I'll explain the feeling. It'll be a very short drive I can guarantee you since you get car sick even as the driver going up Frasers :P ehhehe

 

[cvkit17]

I wouldn't go too hard. My current setup 8k front 5k rear, I personally feel front is too jarring. Whereas the rear is firm but not stiff (if that makes sense). I think you need to have a sit in my car the understand what I mean. Personally I'd suggest you go for softer. 7k 5k perhaps.

Next TT you sit my car and I'll explain the feeling. It'll be a very short drive I can guarantee you since you get car sick even as the driver going up Frasers :P ehhehe

Initial D kaki ini...btw u have changed to adjustables? Or still on stock?

 

[vr2turbo]

I wouldn't go too hard. My current setup 8k front 5k rear, I personally feel front is too jarring. Whereas the rear is firm but not stiff (if that makes sense). I think you need to have a sit in my car the understand what I mean. Personally I'd suggest you go for softer. 7k 5k perhaps.

Next TT you sit my car and I'll explain the feeling. It'll be a very short drive I can guarantee you since you get car sick even as the driver going up Frasers :P ehhehe

But then bro. marv3 ride is French Conti, and they are much more comfy.....

---------- Post added at 08:56 AM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 08:53 AM ----------

Initial D kaki ini...btw u have changed to adjustables? Or still on stock?

You did not read his post? Front 10 click, rear 9 clicks, 8k front, 5k rear. Stock where got these settings......hhahhahahhaha

 

[marv3]

I wouldn't go too hard. My current setup 8k front 5k rear, I personally feel front is too jarring. Whereas the rear is firm but not stiff (if that makes sense). I think you need to have a sit in my car the understand what I mean. Personally I'd suggest you go for softer. 7k 5k perhaps.

Next TT you sit my car and I'll explain the feeling. It'll be a very short drive I can guarantee you since you get car sick even as the driver going up Frasers :P ehhehe

Deiiiii....That is coz all the way speed up leh....And continuous whack left right left right left right......Cut me some slack ler.....Baru belajar ni.....

 

[vr2turbo]

Deiiiii....That is coz all the way speed up leh....And continuous whack left right left right left right......Cut me some slack ler.....Baru belajar ni.....

Actually the driver won't get car sick, is always the passenger.....hhahahhaha

 

[marv3]

Actually the driver won't get car sick, is always the passenger.....hhahahhaha

Initial D got one episode where Takumi challenge the God of Hand in the S2000. The S2000 fella vomit also mah......Hahahahhahaha....

 

[vr2turbo]

Initial D got one episode where Takumi challenge the God of Hand in the S2000. The S2000 fella vomit also mah......Hahahahhahaha....

Driver in control, passenger heart jump out......hhahahhahahaha