You should be able to get those higher rated hoses from spare parts shops.
And thanks for the info on the coolers! I didn't know that. Good thing to share and thanks for sharing!~
[DIY] Automatic Gearbox Cooler
- Thread starter Izso
- Start date
And thanks for the info on the coolers! I didn't know that. Good thing to share and thanks for sharing!~
I haven't had to buy here so cannot guide anyone on buying. If shopping around, it might be easier to ask for a spec rather than saying "hose".
Transmission Oil Cooler Hose. | Goodyear® Engineered Products
That is just an example. You can see the high burst pressure and temp rating. Regular hoses or ones rated for too low a pressure can break.... if lucky you will notice the hose bulging first.
Compare the above link and specs to FUEL hose from same vendor:
Fuel Injection Hose SAE 30R9 | Goodyear® Engineered Products
You can use most anything and get away with it - at least for a while. Some cars have a lower operating pressure than others also and the external pressure range in the line is usually under 500psi. If you noticed this is below the rated burst pressure of good fuel line. This is why some will tell you "it works" to use fuel line. The issue or risk is that the pressure is still higher than normal range for fuel line.
Hope this all makes sense. If you lose pressure from a line while driving on fed highway it will dump ATF at a VERY fast rate.
The ideal is to use metal lines, no rubber. This isn't always practical though.
Asking for Power steering hose might be an alternative choice of words. Just check or ask for the spec.
My .02sen, grains of salt, IMO, mileage may vary, etc
---------- Post added at 09:51 AM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 09:43 AM ----------
Oh: ACE hardware might carry. Check the spools but also the bubble packaged stuff... they might have precut bits. More expensive than spool price. I do not know if they have or not... but there are many ace locations so easy to check.
Transmission Oil Cooler Hose. | Goodyear® Engineered Products
That is just an example. You can see the high burst pressure and temp rating. Regular hoses or ones rated for too low a pressure can break.... if lucky you will notice the hose bulging first.
Compare the above link and specs to FUEL hose from same vendor:
Fuel Injection Hose SAE 30R9 | Goodyear® Engineered Products
You can use most anything and get away with it - at least for a while. Some cars have a lower operating pressure than others also and the external pressure range in the line is usually under 500psi. If you noticed this is below the rated burst pressure of good fuel line. This is why some will tell you "it works" to use fuel line. The issue or risk is that the pressure is still higher than normal range for fuel line.
Hope this all makes sense. If you lose pressure from a line while driving on fed highway it will dump ATF at a VERY fast rate.
The ideal is to use metal lines, no rubber. This isn't always practical though.
Asking for Power steering hose might be an alternative choice of words. Just check or ask for the spec.
My .02sen, grains of salt, IMO, mileage may vary, etc
---------- Post added at 09:51 AM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 09:43 AM ----------
Oh: ACE hardware might carry. Check the spools but also the bubble packaged stuff... they might have precut bits. More expensive than spool price. I do not know if they have or not... but there are many ace locations so easy to check.
Thanks. All what you said is very valid and I agree with you. Hence, now looking for a proper hose before mine gives way. The Hayden instructions said 150psi is good enough (coz the cooler's been tested to 150psi only also), but it's the temperature limitation of the fuel hose that I worry about. Maybe I should just measure the oil temp that's coming out of the external cooler. If it's within 70 deg C then I know I should be okay with the fuel hose.
But I'll try to look for it at ACE, never thought of that. Thanks.
I recently bought another 17 row Hayden cooler. Thought of installing on my Persona, though I haven't heard of the Persona having chronic transmission problems. Thought since the Persona's gearbox is also a Mitsubishi like the Perdana's I may eventually end up with a failure. The cooler cost me RM230 only, so it's ok la.
Persona still uses a torque converter so as long as you drive it hard and fast you'll overheat it. Try driving down Genting on "2" hard and fast, by the time you reach 3/4 or 1/2 way you'll notice the gearbox won't shift gears even if you plonk it into "D".
Coolers are useful for torque converter gearboxes. Not so sure about DSG and the more modern ones though.
Ah.. the spare parts shop I deal with carries it so perhaps I was just lucky. It's cheaper than the fuel hose by RM1.
Side note, I would be curious what the line pressure is at radiator/cooler points on the cars being talked about. Test ports can be pretty high, but not sure what the lines are. Fair to say I would over build the system so this is not any attempt to scare folks. I also have used fuel line before.
Gates says:
Transmission cooler lines use high temperature hose.
Pressures average 75-125 pounds per square inch (psi)
on older cars and can reach a 300 psi surge on
electronically-controlled transmissions.
Gates says:
Transmission cooler lines use high temperature hose.
Pressures average 75-125 pounds per square inch (psi)
on older cars and can reach a 300 psi surge on
electronically-controlled transmissions.
Yeah, but I think that's the best one can do. There is a sensor for the oil temp in the gearbox, but that doesnt help me coz it doesnt tell me what the outlet oil temp is at the cooler. Anyway, rather than trying to find that out it's still easier for me to use a high temp hose instead.
good talk. I suppose if one has the temp gun already you could measure surface temp of the cooler at each end for an indication of % change. Accurate? No, but might be interesting anyway.
i bought a home aircond black sponge hose for RM3 and cladded the cooler outlet hose with it. Seemed to work to keep the oil cooler. The cooler outlet hose (or transmission return hose) was initially picking up the heat from the radiator fan. Now it's insulating from the hot radiator air. Well worth RM3.
overkill with the hose is nothing more than money spent.
Finding out the oil temp and pressure would be more work. At one point of time I wanted to get the oil pressure and oil temp meters for all oil outlets in my car, but it all added up to be more than I could afford so it's temporarily on hold until reliable meters get cheaper.
Just fyi though, most ATF cooler kits come with high pressure hoses, they aren't high temp (ie-fuel hoses). The Oil cooler kits on the other hand come with steel braided hoses. What does that mean? No idea. Oil pressure is probably way higher in the engine compared to the gearbox. That possibly indirectly also means there's less heat in the gearbox? Looking at the original gearbox cooler line, which is one tiny thin line in the radiator (auto cars only) I suspect I'm right. The question is just how hot it's supposed to be.
Considering radiator water temperatures reach up to 80 degrees or 90 degrees in a normal car, the engine oil is probably within the same range or thereabouts.
I'm also going to guess the ATF is not going to be nearly as hot since the stock cooling line is so miniscule in comparison to what the radiator is supposed to do for the engine.
So again, my guess is your 70 degree high pressure fuel hoses is going to last and work normally in your car as long as you don't somehow manage to overheat the ATF. No idea how you'd do that other than driving it hard on a low gear.
Oh btw, I DIY oil removal and I've removed hot ATF oil before. It's not hot enough to burn my hand but it's hot enough to feel uncomfortable.
Finding out the oil temp and pressure would be more work. At one point of time I wanted to get the oil pressure and oil temp meters for all oil outlets in my car, but it all added up to be more than I could afford so it's temporarily on hold until reliable meters get cheaper.
Just fyi though, most ATF cooler kits come with high pressure hoses, they aren't high temp (ie-fuel hoses). The Oil cooler kits on the other hand come with steel braided hoses. What does that mean? No idea. Oil pressure is probably way higher in the engine compared to the gearbox. That possibly indirectly also means there's less heat in the gearbox? Looking at the original gearbox cooler line, which is one tiny thin line in the radiator (auto cars only) I suspect I'm right. The question is just how hot it's supposed to be.
Considering radiator water temperatures reach up to 80 degrees or 90 degrees in a normal car, the engine oil is probably within the same range or thereabouts.
I'm also going to guess the ATF is not going to be nearly as hot since the stock cooling line is so miniscule in comparison to what the radiator is supposed to do for the engine.
So again, my guess is your 70 degree high pressure fuel hoses is going to last and work normally in your car as long as you don't somehow manage to overheat the ATF. No idea how you'd do that other than driving it hard on a low gear.
Oh btw, I DIY oil removal and I've removed hot ATF oil before. It's not hot enough to burn my hand but it's hot enough to feel uncomfortable.
In Hayden's case they provided a length of hose, I assumed that it would be a transmission oil hose (since they recommend us not to use fuel hoses). Anyhow, even if the oil is around 60 or 70 deg C, any slight excursion would start to harm the fuel hose's integrity. I feel that I'm probably playing around with the material's upper limit, and that can't be good. I believe (being kiasu) that I'd be safer looking around for an oil transmission hose that would take higher temps.
Though I do agree with you that transmission oil leaving the box is nowhere as hot as the engine's, the problem is I can't seem to get a real number on how hot or cold it really is. I mean if someone can tell me, by measurement, what the oil temp is then at least I can make a proper technical decision. Now, we are merely guesstimating. This only leaves me to take the conservative route and go hunt for the transmission oil hose.
Though I do agree with you that transmission oil leaving the box is nowhere as hot as the engine's, the problem is I can't seem to get a real number on how hot or cold it really is. I mean if someone can tell me, by measurement, what the oil temp is then at least I can make a proper technical decision. Now, we are merely guesstimating. This only leaves me to take the conservative route and go hunt for the transmission oil hose.
Considering the cost of the hose, forget about guestimating and go get the proper hose la. It's very cheap by the meter and the possible resulting damage isn't worth all this guessing!
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