4 throttle into ae92

[mastakilla]

hi to all,

I'm sorry if this topic has been discussed before.

I'm driving toyota SE, and just complete transplanting 4age from ae92 into my car.
although in the first place im dreaming of blacktop, but due to fund yg "kurengz" i decided to stick with ae92.now the nooby question :_: ;

1) someone said that i can fit the 4throttle from either svt or bt into my engine.is it true?

2)if that can be done,whats the estimated cost to install it?

3)any downside or negative effect from fitting it?

thanks.

 

[ahchi]

I think if you have transplanted 16V, better stick to it. It's not worth to upgrade to 20v svt or bt since the improvement is not so obvious, some forumer even change back from svt to 16v. I suggest you spend the rest of the money to upgrade your 16v since its known as a tough and a good engine to modify.

 

[mastakilla]

hmm..seems like i'm not stating it clearly in my forst post.

what i mean is.. using the svt's throttle body..

err..i hope this time i said it correctly :P

 

[scomatic]

Another popular topic these days is adapting the individual throttles from the 20V onto the 16V..."Can this be done?" You bet! But there are many obstacles which may hinder your attempt and here's some of them. NO! you will not be able to use the 16V ECU to run the throttle as fuel map requirements are vastly different for the 20'v throttle unit. The lower rpm ranges require much less fuel while in the upper ranges the throttle needs significantly more fuel. Since the whole idea of making precise fuel maps are the key to making the difficult and sensitive 4 throttle to work well, it is not a matter of backyard tuning by simply shifting AFM or Vacuum Sensor signals or shuffling fuel pressures. You must almost always use an aftermarket or re-computed ECU get anywhere near the operation you need...even to match the original spec of the single throttle you tossed in the garbage. Second, since the 20V's idle is controlled not by the TPS and the throttle body, but rather a secondary port called ISCV which leaks idle air in a controlled manner aft of the fully closed throttles. Since the 16V engines never had this, you have to figure out a way to devise a similar tactics through your own ingenious method. The throttle in any case must be fully closed to get idle mixture control on. The manifold will not bolt on to the 16V's intake so an adapter should be used or fabricated. Overall, not many of the private shops have successfully made such setups perform better than what can easily be done with the single throttle, even though almost all of them have succeeded in getting a car to run decently. That said, there are a handful of shops that did make things work wonderfully (all in Japan that I have seen) with the 20V throttle mechanism and kits are available. Be cautioned that they are NOT cheap and greatly exceeds the cost of swapping the entire 20V instead, because it will require a fully programmable ECU and their research results in the form of software. For many of us, a set of side draft carburetor will be a more effective and much cheaper option than grafting the individual throttles on the 16V.

 

[SubVerSiv]

You can call Arthur to get this modification done at a cost of around RM1k++ (including ITB). Adapter readily available. 012-3221992

 

[ae101svt]

0123688497 Kong
this guy got 2 nos of 16v 4 throttles but wif engine....
one of them just arrived from japan....
goodluck

 

[4AGTE]

gud luck with ur modification and dont forget to post the result here!!!!

 

[EG9]

better stick to 16V and use back the original intake manifold. Use the extra money to get racing cam, adjustable cam pulley, and standalone ECU.

 

[rollakid]

better stick to 16V and use back the original intake manifold. Use the extra money to get racing cam, adjustable cam pulley, and standalone ECU.

yeah agreed, you can gain alot more buy using the money you use to convert to ITB than converting to ITB itself.

unless ofcourse you are just into the sound of ITB.. but still i think quiet quiet tapau everyone on the road is better

 

[samuelccy]

better stick to 16V and use back the original intake manifold. Use the extra money to get racing cam, adjustable cam pulley, and standalone ECU.

Bro, is this applicable to stock engine AE111? n how much would it cost r?

 

[rollakid]

Bro, is this applicable to stock engine AE111? n how much would it cost r?

you mean 4afe? bill sherwood is building one now, dunno if it is completed or not. But he is using individual throttle ofcourse, custom made by a company name "Alloy Race Componet". Then motec ecu, custom made dry sump oil system -__-", 280degree 11.3mm lift cams, and fully worked cylinder head.

he mention he wanted to use the 7A block, but doesnt mean he'll run 1.8liter since he's using 4a crank anyway, he's just after the longer conrod for longer tdc dwell time for less frictional power loss, and custom made titanium rods from cunningham ofcourse (i wanted one of those too... damn pretty rods)

he estimated 240hp@9500rpm AND streetable on normal driving, then he found out that his setup is theorically better than a friend of his who already did one before and running 248hp@9000rpm so he is expecting more from his setup now.

resource:
http://www.billzilla.org/starleteng.htm

 

[samuelccy]

you mean 4afe? bill sherwood is building one now, dunno if it is completed or not. But he is using individual throttle ofcourse, custom made by a company name "Alloy Race Componet". Then motec ecu, custom made dry sump oil system -__-", 280degree 11.3mm lift cams, and fully worked cylinder head.

he mention he wanted to use the 7A block, but doesnt mean he'll run 1.8liter since he's using 4a crank anyway, he's just after the longer conrod for longer tdc dwell time for less frictional power loss, and custom made titanium rods from cunningham ofcourse (i wanted one of those too... damn pretty rods)

he estimated 240hp@9500rpm AND streetable on normal driving, then he found out that his setup is theorically better than a friend of his who already did one before and running 248hp@9000rpm so he is expecting more from his setup now.

resource:
http://www.billzilla.org/starleteng.htm

Wow !! .. it seems like is gonna b a hell big project rite ... it 'll cost alot of $$$ ... yes yes .. is 4AFE .. I still thinking on whether to mod my 4AFE kao kao or juz turbo charge it .. wat I can mod wif a budget of rm5k on my 4AFE n how much hp I can gain from there r? ... by turbo charge it .. I think I can get arnd 100hp gain ..

 

[rollakid]

Wow !! .. it seems like is gonna b a hell big project rite ... it 'll cost alot of $$$ ... yes yes .. is 4AFE .. I still thinking on whether to mod my 4AFE kao kao or juz turbo charge it .. wat I can mod wif a budget of rm5k on my 4AFE n how much hp I can gain from there r? ... by turbo charge it .. I think I can get arnd 100hp gain ..

one thing you must remember is that 5k budget is really small for turbocharging a non-force induction ready engine like the 4agze. you will end up sourcing turbines and intercooler from chop shop, as well as engine internal. must remember you need to pay for labour too.

 

[samuelccy]

one thing you must remember is that 5k budget is really small for turbocharging a non-force induction ready engine like the 4agze. you will end up sourcing turbines and intercooler from chop shop, as well as engine internal. must remember you need to pay for labour too.

yeah yea ... I was quote at 6k ++ include E-manage n the other package was 8k++ .. I aldy added E-manage .. so from the 6k++ can deduct 1.5k thn would b abt 5k lor ... juz would like to noe wat I can do to my 4AFE wif tht budget n how much hp I can gain ... If can I would like to stick to NA instead of turbo charge my car ... juz thinking of in terms of hp n overall ... which would more worthy ...

 

[rollakid]

one thing for sure is that if you are after as much HP with as little money as posible, the only way is to turbocharge it.

for a 240hp 4afe like in bill's site, depends on who you find to build your engine, it could cost anywhere from 30k ringgit to 100k ringgit.. or maybe more.. who knows.. just a set of cunningham rod will cost you back a few thousand, motec over 10 thousand.. and more custom made stuff.. you get the idea..

 

[EG9]

Bro, is this applicable to stock engine AE111? n how much would it cost r?

4AFE engine compression and air flow is not as good as 4AGE, better look for 4AGE 20V blacktop engine kosong (with ITB, extractor and gearbox) cost: Around RM1700 - RM2000+ standalone ECU. (Microtech is around RM4K plus tuning)
Good enough to tapau alot of car including those with race cam engine if tune properly.

 

[samuelccy]

one thing for sure is that if you are after as much HP with as little money as posible, the only way is to turbocharge it.

for a 240hp 4afe like in bill's site, depends on who you find to build your engine, it could cost anywhere from 30k ringgit to 100k ringgit.. or maybe more.. who knows.. just a set of cunningham rod will cost you back a few thousand, motec over 10 thousand.. and more custom made stuff.. you get the idea..

yeah yeah ... I'm still in dilemma as my aim is to tapau those 1.8 stock engine n I was inform tht GTI is having arnd 140hp n my 4AFE is impossible to achieve 180hp unless turbo charge it ... thts y I came out wif the idea to turbo charge my 4AFE ... n btw, in terms of FC .. is there any diff between turbo charger n NA if they are the same hp? ... for example ... I mod my car in NA condition to achieve 180hp compare to a turbo charger tht having 180hp ... which FC would b better or would it b the same? ..

 

[samuelccy]

4AFE engine compression and air flow is not as good as 4AGE, better look for 4AGE 20V blacktop engine kosong (with ITB, extractor and gearbox) cost: Around RM1700 - RM2000+ standalone ECU. (Microtech is around RM4K plus tuning)
Good enough to tapau alot of car including those with race cam engine if tune properly.

so the cost would b arnd 6k++ .. u mean I can fit the 4AGE 20V Blacktop engine to my set of 4AFE wiring ? ... I'm currently using 20V Blacktop MT gearbox le ...

 

[rollakid]

so the cost would b arnd 6k++ .. u mean I can fit the 4AGE 20V Blacktop engine to my set of 4AFE wiring ? ... I'm currently using 20V Blacktop MT gearbox le ...

i dun think 4afe wiring can fit.. you'll need the wiring from the standalone ecu... i think.. thats why sifu eg9 say microtech cost rm4k + tuning, guess it should include wiring?

 

[samuelccy]

i dun think 4afe wiring can fit.. you'll need the wiring from the standalone ecu... i think.. thats why sifu eg9 say microtech cost rm4k + tuning, guess it should include wiring?

okie okie ... it means I juz take the 20V BT but using ano standalone ECU to map everything la ... now I got the idea ... by doing tht how much hp I can gain ah sife EG9?