Nuclear power

[netmatrix]

I would prefer we go solar and wind than nuke. But it cost less to build a nuke plant than solar or wind combined. We can't go geothermal as we don't have too many hot stuff running under our country.

 

[csl]

Short and long term cost will be more than nuclear by far margin and occupied massive space, just to produce 50% of a nuclear plant output.

We of cause have another alternative - use palm oil to burn. Long term cost will be very scary and of cause, the carbon index will be sky high. Many people will get cancer and that will be after their retire age. Effected coverage will be wider than a nuclear plant explode and more difficult to detect. All sickness only come after long period of continuous expose.

If want go solar, it will be encourage individual to buy themselves (like china and taiwan). If wind, not to say may effect the eco system but there are something hidden and of cause, 1 giant generator barely can provide enough output for a family so how much space needed is a question. Batteries to store the power is a very big problem.

There are actually more technical thing on every type of energy source. Many countries had studied and finally picked nuclear not for no reason. It is not that they cannot effort but there is really some issues that had never disclosed and ordinary people doesn't have a clue. Who in this world don't know nuclear plant explode will create a mess BTW.

 

[netmatrix]

Would nuke plant work in space without oxigen?

 

[jat1917]

read this n the comment..NUCLEAR POWER - Che Det

 

[csl]

TDM already mention: we do not know much about nuclear.

If don't know much how the rest of the writing can be justified?

I read some comments over there and not really useful after all. All I can say is, Oil is gonna finish. We are not as capable as a lot of countries in terms of having huge reserves. Things that put in front of our table are nuclear, solar and wind. I don't like to dream about future. I'm those who gonna build a future type of people. Car accident kill more people so don't drive car? Plane crash kill everyone so ban flight? Gas tank in house just like a bomb so only eat sushi? From this nuclear thing, again, I found another bad attitude - Lazy to study and straight go with assumption.

All nuclear countries now revising their nuclear plant. What they are revising? To shut down immediately and not use in the future? Or revising their emergency plan? or revising what can be upgrade to prevent sht happen? Or just a drama to show that their gov do care about people? Or whatever you can think.

We are steered by the news and news from kopitiam. Lack of balls, lack of independent thinking, lack of knowledge and lack of creativity.

Tell me how the nuclear thing can generate electricity.

 

[jat1917]

http://media1.malaysiakini.com/341/10938ccc6caa08a2c8ec1c4c8df01538.gif

YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 1
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 2
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 3
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 4
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 5
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 6
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 7
YouTube - Chernobyl disaster incident PART 8
YouTube - Chernobyl: 23 years later

the benefit comes with the high risk..until now at chernobyl,no one can stop the uranium 235 from emit the radiation and it will last for hundred thousand years or milion years to stop emit..prevention is better than cure..just share..

 

[csl]

What's the different between honda civic EG vs FD2?

What's different between Nokia 3210 vs N8?

Old stories are history. What we have today is another level of hard/software. Totally cannot use history to justify the risk. The most just only can be a reference and nothing more than that. What we have now is same damage but lower possibilities to be happen. And many ways to prevent sht happen. Why a nuclear plant cannot be a floating platform? Why must be build on land? And why a floating platform cannot built and stay on land? Why cooling must use water but nothing else as emergency substitute? Why emergency respond must wait until smoke come out but not trigger before sht happen? How a remote monitoring system works? A lot of things can be done but no one has interest to think out of a box for a solution. This is one of the reason I made this thread besides complaining Malaysians politicians' stupidity. I'm not Obama but I want malaysians to change. My little capability is up to here.

One of the function of history is for people to learn the fault from the past. But we only know to history to deny future. I'm not saying you jat1917, you provide valuable information. People can learn from the video (but how much they can catch is no guaranty). I'm pointing to the female politicians from DAP who wrote an article on Chinapress.

 

[mizunori77]

people WONT die from using old mobile phones, the most is they get laughed at for being a tech dinosaur.

however, people will die when exposed to radiation, regardless of how technologically advanced the society or the nation has become.

there is a singular weakness amongst all the countries, regardless of technology or whatever inventions humans can create. that weakness is our physiology.

we are not superhumans that can withstand high doses of radiation.

in japan's case, radiation levels of up to 400 mSv per HOUR were recorded near Fukushima Reactor 4, while 100 mSv per YEAR is considered a safe level.

japan's super advanced technology couldn't protect the 50 people working day and night at fukushima nuclear plant from dying.

i sincerely salute the 50 people sacrificing their lives while trying desperate to save thousands of others.

do you think the employees of malaysian electrical companies WILL SACRIFICE THEIR LIVES to protect others when they couldn't be bothered to even talk to us nicely when we report power outages? sometimes they don't even answer the damn phone!

as another malaysian, i will NOT agree to some money-making project that will endanger my life or the life of my family and friends or my future generations, just because some politicians think it is cool to have not one, but two nuclear plants in the country.

if they want nuclear plants, they can build one on some island far away and live with the damn nuclear plant next door. they don't even have to worry about not having enough electricity.

for the rest of us malaysians, we would rather have wind farms or solar power which although would cost more, it won't kill us.

btw, WHICH mega project in malaysia is not costly? would you rather pay A LOT and die faster or pay A LOT but live longer? :hmmmm:

 

[jat1917]

agree with mizunori77..too high the risk to build nuke power plant..if the nuke fail,the victim is people..not just hundred people will be victim,but thousand people..we must think about the risk before we agree with it...

 

[BE5RSK]

If we look at the cost benefit factor, of course nuclear power plant is more effective to produce higher energy output with less cost compared with other solutions (eg. solar, wind and hydro).

BUT the risk if something bad happened to it (accident), are utterly unbearable. Of course we can learn from history to improvise its safety by putting the greatest back-up plan and contingency plan if something bad occurred. Of course it will reduce the risk, but not totally eliminated it. If it happened, only God knows how we could survive.

One thing for sure, if shit happened to nuclear reactor plant, the risk of losing life and endanger to our future generation (radiation transmitted) are there. Not to mention the damage to environment (eg. soil, rivers, flora and fauna). And the cost of rescue operations and corrective measurement will cost us a lots of money.

As for me, i dont mind if most of the developed countries are already using it since a long time ago. It is their choice. Maybe they have very limited options to increase their energy supply to cover their industries demand. But I dont see Malaysia are in real need for this nuclear power as for now, and I do hope we will have other option (instead of nuclear) in future to meet our country's demand for energy.

Based on our current peoples' mentality and attitude (Government, Private sectors, and public), I dont think that we are ready for nuclear power at the moment, maybe even in next 30 years. Just look at Japanese peoples during facing the current catastrophe. They are absolutely in stress and panic situations, but they still gave good cooperation to their government authority to handle it. I see a lots of photo that they patiently queuing properly and follow the instructions before receive the treatment. Just imagine if the same accident happened in KL? One thing for sure, they will be like a riot situation...

 

[jat1917]

read this about when the nuke power plant fail..
Chernobyl disaster effects - Wikipedia, the free [email]encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Question_book-new.svg[/email]" class="image"><img alt="Question book-new.svg" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/99/Question_book-new.svg/50px-Question_book-new.svg.png"@@AMEPARAM@@en/thumb/9/99/Question_book-new.svg/50px-Question_book-new.svg.png

---------- Post added at 12:52 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 12:35 PM ----------

think about this happen in malaysia long ago...see the gov deal with radioactive material and not to try save the people...

Nasrudin: Jika selamat, mengapa tak bina di Perth? - Malaysiakini

 

[driftkingII]

ok, this is from my opinion.

If they still want to go on with Nuclear Power, we need people who have SKILLS !! who are willing to sacrifice their lives in their work.

sorry to say but we lack of people who are not skillful in nuclear. For example a fren of mine studying Nuclear Engineering in UKM, seriously an easy question about nuclear she cannot answer even get the correct calculation.

Well i am a n was a psychics student, so i still remembered the Nuclear Equation n Half Life formula.

Image we have people who cannot handle nuclear.. we may end up like Chernobyl !!!

Chernobyl happens just bcoz of a simple mistake same goes to the Three Miles Island nuclear disaster

how about building one nuclear powerplant.. sure u need more experience.. u can do it with normal resources.. this is not building KLCC but something which is fatal !!

they also cannot use cheap materials for it... to dangerous...

speaking of Nuclear in Japan, the Mihama Nuclear Plant is still giving probs even after it's worst accident in 2004.

Lets say after we manage to build, what happens to the nuclear waste?? xkan nak buang dlm Tong sampah or river (like most factories do)

people who are living near the nuclear reactor area are force to take vaccinations !! this will increase the medical cost..

next if happens a fatal accident.. it is going to cost more than millions of ringgit to repair n protect the people.. yes, u are not talking about a few thousand but millions... this is dangerous.. also people will be effected.

ok here ends my nuclear story..

i prefer Solar energy for Malaysia since we have sun also wind energy which we have strong winds..

i heard one Malaysian documentary, they recommend WAVE energy from the water waves in Sabah n coastal areas in Malaysia...

 

[csl]

As what I expected since the beginning.

1st of all, you need to understand what is risk. To be more down to earth, risk is basically the chance of sht happen. Damage is the sht happen. Due to wrong use of the wording, things can be 180 degree turned and become another story. That had mislead a lot of people.

What type of risk we will need to face when there is a nuclear plant? Example: Nuclear core explode. What will be the damage? Answer: Every life form within certain area will die or suffer from radiation and the radio active effect will last for long time within the radius of effected area which will cause most life form unable to live there.

I believe these 2 things are the only things that most Malaysians knows and the only thing what appear in their mind is: Nuclear plant will definitely explode and we all gonna die. Nothing more that that.

I don't blame the rakyat because they never have a chance to learn about control, management, risk assessment, and etc. Those who born with such instinct or talent, had been washed out by their greedy bosses when they tried to do something good end up with kena blasted because of wasting money and time. Part of the culture. No hope. Here goes why plenty of people don't like china product and Malaysians are basically towards that direction.

Back to the topic.

When you think nuclear plant has a potential for creating a man made disaster, do you also think about what is the high potential and not like gonna happen type of root cause and the possible solution for them? If you don't think and straight away deny of its existence, here goes our future and I should consider to migrate to some other countries which have majority people who know how to think before making their stands clear. I can't blame our parliament YBs are such a bunch of fools because they need to debate like a fools to get the foolish people support. Just like those who talk about human rights in Gaddafi's parliament will eventually being wipe off outside the building by the foolish supporter. My purpose of making this thread is to encourage people to make a step forward to analyze a thing. Not jump off from no where and making a strong stand of banning women for wearing shorts because it will create traffic accident. We are not living in 200 BC BTW.

Debating on the nuclear plant is not as important as the attitude of handling an issue.

But if you would like to know about people who work in a nuclear plant, how nuclear plant works, Nuclear plant safety and etc, please google it and read from different source. As far as I know, those people who handle a very tiny volume of radio active source, they need to fulfill the requirement like professionalism, fixed neutralized schedule (including work hour), frequent medical check up, and many many more. Basically they need to have a test and obtain the license for handle the sht. On the plant building, even a bolt need to be certified. That's why when the tsunami hit japan and damage the nuclear plant cooling supply, the core won't just blow out as fast as the bomb dropped in hiroshima. They still have chance to save it from turning into a big disaster.

On the management and control point of view, if need people to sacrifice their life for saving a building, that's mean it is not good enough (I called it failure). They need to implement some policy and solution for handle such issues. I would say, the recent japan nuclear plant incident had exposed the weakness and the carelessness of the management. One of the lesson learned is not building it nearby seaside to save cost, regardless it is for short or long term. And there is no mobile water pump unit which quite surprise me for an advance country like japan. I would like to know when this plant had been built and started operation.

Perhaps, I should start drawing my concept and let you guys see (in few days). There is no problem to waste money on over spec engineering but when save money and walk on the engineering limit, anytime will fall down. I like to call these bastard as smart a$$. And yes, I'm the hard core bad guy as usual.

---------- Post added at 03:34 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 03:25 PM ----------

ok, this is from my opinion.

If they still want to go on with Nuclear Power, we need people who have SKILLS !! who are willing to sacrifice their lives in their work.

sorry to say but we lack of people who are not skillful in nuclear. For example a fren of mine studying Nuclear Engineering in UKM, seriously an easy question about nuclear she cannot answer even get the correct calculation.

Well i am a n was a psychics student, so i still remembered the Nuclear Equation n Half Life formula.

Image we have people who cannot handle nuclear.. we may end up like Chernobyl !!!

Chernobyl happens just bcoz of a simple mistake same goes to the Three Miles Island nuclear disaster

how about building one nuclear powerplant.. sure u need more experience.. u can do it with normal resources.. this is not building KLCC but something which is fatal !!

they also cannot use cheap materials for it... to dangerous...

speaking of Nuclear in Japan, the Mihama Nuclear Plant is still giving probs even after it's worst accident in 2004.

Lets say after we manage to build, what happens to the nuclear waste?? xkan nak buang dlm Tong sampah or river (like most factories do)

people who are living near the nuclear reactor area are force to take vaccinations !! this will increase the medical cost..

next if happens a fatal accident.. it is going to cost more than millions of ringgit to repair n protect the people.. yes, u are not talking about a few thousand but millions... this is dangerous.. also people will be effected.

ok here ends my nuclear story..

i prefer Solar energy for Malaysia since we have sun also wind energy which we have strong winds..

i heard one Malaysian documentary, they recommend WAVE energy from the water waves in Sabah n coastal areas in Malaysia...

Sorry, things need to be corrected:

1. Many people lives nearby nuclear plant without the need of vaccination, in Korea and Japan, according to the news. other countries not known.

2. Certain countries does collect waste nuclear sht for recycle them and sell them back.

3. Millions or ringgit is for make danger signs. Actual thing need to calculate by Billion in units.

 

[driftkingII]

Sorry, things need to be corrected:

1. Many people lives nearby nuclear plant without the need of vaccination, in Korea and Japan, according to the news. other countries not known.

2. Certain countries does collect waste nuclear sht for recycle them and sell them back.

3. Millions or ringgit is for make danger signs. Actual thing need to calculate by Billion in units.

thanx for the facts n correcting it. I am still learning about it slowly.

regarding on vaccination, my niece told me.. that where she lives (US), people there was force to take vaccinations incase of a power plant disaster.

but clear me if i am wrong, i remembered TVP used to have a little documentary about Nuclear Power everyday (during the TVP glory days).. i learn a lot from there b4 i entered the science stream.

 

[jat1917]

As what I expected since the beginning.

1st of all, you need to understand what is risk. To be more down to earth, risk is basically the chance of sht happen. Damage is the sht happen. Due to wrong use of the wording, things can be 180 degree turned and become another story. That had mislead a lot of people.

What type of risk we will need to face when there is a nuclear plant? Example: Nuclear core explode. What will be the damage? Answer: Every life form within certain area will die or suffer from radiation and the radio active effect will last for long time within the radius of effected area which will cause most life form unable to live there.

I believe these 2 things are the only things that most Malaysians knows and the only thing what appear in their mind is: Nuclear plant will definitely explode and we all gonna die. Nothing more that that.

I don't blame the rakyat because they never have a chance to learn about control, management, risk assessment, and etc. Those who born with such instinct or talent, had been washed out by their greedy bosses when they tried to do something good end up with kena blasted because of wasting money and time. Part of the culture. No hope. Here goes why plenty of people don't like china product and Malaysians are basically towards that direction.

Back to the topic.

When you think nuclear plant has a potential for creating a man made disaster, do you also think about what is the high potential and not like gonna happen type of root cause and the possible solution for them? If you don't think and straight away deny of its existence, here goes our future and I should consider to migrate to some other countries which have majority people who know how to think before making their stands clear. I can't blame our parliament YBs are such a bunch of fools because they need to debate like a fools to get the foolish people support. Just like those who talk about human rights in Gaddafi's parliament will eventually being wipe off outside the building by the foolish supporter. My purpose of making this thread is to encourage people to make a step forward to analyze a thing. Not jump off from no where and making a strong stand of banning women for wearing shorts because it will create traffic accident. We are not living in 200 BC BTW.

Debating on the nuclear plant is not as important as the attitude of handling an issue.

But if you would like to know about people who work in a nuclear plant, how nuclear plant works, Nuclear plant safety and etc, please google it and read from different source. As far as I know, those people who handle a very tiny volume of radio active source, they need to fulfill the requirement like professionalism, fixed neutralized schedule (including work hour), frequent medical check up, and many many more. Basically they need to have a test and obtain the license for handle the sht. On the plant building, even a bolt need to be certified. That's why when the tsunami hit japan and damage the nuclear plant cooling supply, the core won't just blow out as fast as the bomb dropped in hiroshima. They still have chance to save it from turning into a big disaster.

On the management and control point of view, if need people to sacrifice their life for saving a building, that's mean it is not good enough (I called it failure). They need to implement some policy and solution for handle such issues. I would say, the recent japan nuclear plant incident had exposed the weakness and the carelessness of the management. One of the lesson learned is not building it nearby seaside to save cost, regardless it is for short or long term. And there is no mobile water pump unit which quite surprise me for an advance country like japan. I would like to know when this plant had been built and started operation.

Perhaps, I should start drawing my concept and let you guys see (in few days). There is no problem to waste money on over spec engineering but when save money and walk on the engineering limit, anytime will fall down. I like to call these bastard as smart a$$. And yes, I'm the hard core bad guy as usual.

---------- Post added at 03:34 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 03:25 PM ----------



as worker working with radoactive everyday,i said yes u must sacrifice ur self if emergency situation occur..u must..radioactive material dun have switch for u to turn on or off..it always emit the radiation..even in it special container,it still have radiation surround the container..like worker at fukushima reactor,in 1 hour they already absorb 400msv per hour..mean in 1 hour they absorb for 8years radiation limit..50msv per year only u can absorb according to international standart..more than that,u are in serious health situation..so,if nuke power plant build in malaysia,the very first victim when the reactor leak or explode,is the worker..they will sacrifice them self for saving another life..how many worker in malaysia will sacrifice them self?i think no one will do it if that thing will make u died faster..nuke power plant using more powerful radioactive material than im using everyday..so the effect is more higher in short time...radioctive material not easy to handle..coz u cannot touch it.. u deal with radioactive,u must absorb the radiation..sory for my bad english.just share..:stupido: