Hydrogen Fuel Saving Device Demystified

[kl_petrolhead]

I have tried a number of fuel saving methods before, such as adding fuel additives (octane boosters, marvel energy oil) some of them work and some don't, the latter does, the initial doesn't unless the engine is modified to make full use of higher octane fuel.

Lately word has been going around about a new fuel saving device that claims to be able to reduce fuel consumption by about 20 - 30% by just adding water to some kind of device. I was doubtful at first with the less than positive response from my friends, but after doing some research it does make quite a bit of sense.

I came across this website http://cressfuelenhancer.wordpress.com/ selling the hydrogen fuel saving device. The website explains how the device works, it separates oxygen and hydrogen gas from water and creates oxyhyrogen gas through a simple secondary school experiment process of electrolysis (but of course in a more refined form). The website also says that both oxygen and hydrogen gas help improve fuel efficiency by burning fuel efficiently.

So my next question is how does hydrogen help in saving fuel?. Yes basic science tells me that oxygen will indeed help improve burning but how does hydrogen help. I did further research on the internet and i found this website http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/11/hydrogenenhance.html, according to their experiment adding hydrogen to petrol or diesel will improve fuel efficiency by enabling the engine to run on a leaner mixture.

Theoretically, their device does make technical sense. Now comes my third question, is that small device able to produce enough HHO gas for the engine. I took a quick look at their specifications at http://cressfuelenhancer.wordpress.com/products/cress-hm500mk/ and it claims to be able to produce 50 liters of gas per hour, given that my car fuel tank only takes only 45 liters of fuel, i guess the device should work.

Now considering that adding oxygen and hydrogen helps burn fuel better, i suppose i will be getting more horsepower and cleaner exhaust gas.

I am planning to try this device next month when my next pay cheque comes in, what do you guys think about this device?

 

[super fei lo]

Dear petrol head,

Im an NGV sales guy from batu caves.
I heard so so many of this so called petrol saving devices that cost few hundred to thousand of ringgit from my customers,but the end up to my shop and install a NGV system...
Some of the devices workin and some of them did not....
i think better u go and try out their demo units and then u travel with and without the system running..
so u can differentiate it.....
more power?
less FC?
or its just BULLS**T

i believe nowadays we really should take gd use of our hard earned money...
good luck and pls share the experince with us after u install

 

[lozo]

i'm doing a study on this hydrogen bi fuel thingy.

yes, adding hydrogen will simply extend the lean operating range of an engine. but you need pure hydrogen gas, and need some ignition retard due to fast burning of hydrogen gas. electrolysis of water produce hydrogen + oxygen, which is called brown gas..not that efficient to be applied as a fuel saving device imho.

p/s : this thing has been tested long time ago, since the 70's by NASA

 

[alantan]

Kl Petrol Head,

go to youtube and check out the HHO system that you're talking about.
to feel less dissapointed if your ptoduct fails.study and learn more about it.

Hydrogen has higher burning ratio compared to oxygen alone.

regards,
alantan

 

[donCityZ]

its being tested long ago, and yet, not one single car has been manufactured with it.
isnt it weird how that works?

 

[kl_petrolhead]

Well there are a few good reasons i can think of why car makers don't fit it as stock:
1) Cost, just like turbo, not every car has it, but cars like Volvo have it as stock and it not only gives more horsepower but also improves mileage.
2) Maintenance, according to that website, we need to refill water every 400 - 500 kilometers or so, the general population might not like that, this i believe is a very strong reason why car manufacturers don't fit it as stock. For me i am fine with that, as long as it gives me fuel savings.
3) Still on maintenance, by having less components in the car, manufacturers can worry less about reliability.
4) It may well be that car makers may not know it all. If we liken car makers to the great banks of American, we all thought they knew the economy very well, but now what has become if it?

Nonetheless i have yet to try the device out, if any of you know someone who has used it before let me know. I am still very fond of this device.

 

[oligokoko]

dear zthians,

yes d hydrogen generator unit does work. n believe me it does give u better FC n power (proven by mythbusters crew also!). but this is in d early stages n depend on how u jaga it. after a while, u need 2 clean d hydrogen generator as d water turns 2 brown due to electrolysis. n believe me, it turns brown very fast n letting d water in brown colour for a week will reduce d efficientcy of d generator.

d gud thing about this product is, u can install more than 1 generator in d car. d more d better FC n power it will give. but just like one mentioned in this forum b4, have u ever wondered y this doesnt come out as a std in normal road car. d research is done way back in d 1970's. FMHO, i think it is because hydrogen is highly flamable. placing d generator in d engine bay will somehow bring danger 2 d driver, passenger n also other motorist. just imagine, ur car crash, fuel line broke n started a fire. battery still connected n still supplying d hydrogen generator. guess what will happen then.

so, from all this blabs, i do say tht hydrogen generator will improfe FC n power but i strongly suggest u not 2 install this device due to safety measures.

 

[InitialD]

Info from Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiStkCLyTEM

During the Tokyo Auto Salon 2009 show, Mazda exhibited a "Premacy Hydrogen RE Hybrid" concept car that is based on a new concept that combines a hydrogen rotary engine with a hybrid system.

Capable of using either hydrogen or gasoline, the dual fuel system can keep the car running on gasoline even when the hydrogen fuel runs out.

The hybrid system efficiently converts hydrogen fuel energy to electric energy to drive the motor, and provides high energy efficiency with superior response, enabling fuel-efficient powerful driving performance with a direct feel.

Mazda began leasing the "RX-8 Hydrogen RE" in 2006 as a clean car equipped with a hydrogen rotary engine and is making significant contributions to the development of a hydrogen infrastructure for the future. When running on hydrogen, the exhibited Premacy can travel up to 200km, which is double the cruising range of the RX-8 Hydrogen RE.

 

[PocketRocket]

Hydrogen hybrids are making an entry in US already and so is bio-diesel (corn oil), i may not be so technical about these thing simply because i dont know the mechanics of these, BUT what i do know is that hydrogen fuel devices and conversions are available in Malaysia already and FC is improve with limited power loss.

Someday, NGV being a fossil fuel will run out too...but not bio-diesel and Hydrogen

Off topic - Angelina Jolie's 7-Series is equipped with customed Hydrogen alternative fuels...

 

[kl_petrolhead]

Info from Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiStkCLyTEM

During the Tokyo Auto Salon 2009 show, Mazda exhibited a "Premacy Hydrogen RE Hybrid" concept car that is based on a new concept that combines a hydrogen rotary engine with a hybrid system.

Capable of using either hydrogen or gasoline, the dual fuel system can keep the car running on gasoline even when the hydrogen fuel runs out.

The hybrid system efficiently converts hydrogen fuel energy to electric energy to drive the motor, and provides high energy efficiency with superior response, enabling fuel-efficient powerful driving performance with a direct feel.

Mazda began leasing the "RX-8 Hydrogen RE" in 2006 as a clean car equipped with a hydrogen rotary engine and is making significant contributions to the development of a hydrogen infrastructure for the future. When running on hydrogen, the exhibited Premacy can travel up to 200km, which is double the cruising range of the RX-8 Hydrogen RE.

Wow, this is something really interesting, having a gasoline hydrogen hybrid which can use both fuels interchangeably. So i guess the hydrogen fuel enhancing device really works.

On the topic on hydrogen fuel saving devices, I came across an article on Bernama recently, a farmer developed a similar system and apparently it works - http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v5/newsindex.php?id=344947 . Nonetheless in the picture the system uses plastic water filter canisters for the electrolysis.

 

[jswong]

Don't confuse hydrogen hybrids with those hydrogen fuel-saving devices. Hydrogen hybrids use hydrogen gas (not HHO) through another device to produce electricity, e.g. like methanol fuel cells. It's a chemical reaction to produce electricity. When running with hydrogen fuel, hydrogen hybrids use the generated electricity to power electric motors.

It is totally, totally different from HHO devices.

Furthermore, why do some vehicles run fine with HHO gas and others don't? The reason is because for HHO gas to enrich the fuel-air charge so that less fuel is required, the car needs to know that the mixture is now richer due to the presence of HHO, and deliver less fuel so that the effective air-fuel ratio remains around the same.

If you have an open-loop ECU, it's not likely this will work because the ECU doesn't monitor the AFR of the burnt mixture.

If you have a carb, perhaps you'll have to adjust the jetting of both the carb and the HHO generator, but that'll mean that your engine will be running way too lean once water runs out, so you can't really run dual-fuel.

If you have a closed-loop ECU, there's a possibility that it'll work but the combustion of hydrogen within a steel or cast iron engine block will result in premature fracturing due to hydrogen embrittlement.

This is the primary reason why car manufacturers don't use it as a standard device, because prolonged combustion of hydrogen in a regular internal combustion engine will cause the engine block to crack prematurely due to the reaction between hydrogen and steel.

P.S. as for NASA testing such devices, it's normal for NASA to test any power generation system. If, for them, you can provide distilled water to a spacecraft and let the solar cells power the electrolysis process, and then you burn the resultant HHO gas to produce thrust, no doubt this would be a desirable technology for space travel. But guess why it hasn't been deployed to any space probes, and not even to satellites in orbit that get regular amounts of sunlight and only need an occasional jolt of thrust to keep their positions in orbit.

 

[donCityZ]

This is the primary reason why car manufacturers don't use it as a standard device, because prolonged combustion of hydrogen in a regular internal combustion engine will cause the engine block to crack prematurely due to the reaction between hydrogen and steel.

This is what made me cancel my project. I dowan my engine kong before i finish the car loan.

 

[`Blitz]

This is what made me cancel my project. I dowan my engine kong before i finish the car loan.

Lucky u cancel the project... I oredi got conned... This HHO fuel saving device only works for a few minutes... after that no effect... As my car is EFI, this device spoilt my ECU and i had to change the ECU... cost me RM500 for it.

I tried to get refund as the salesman said u can return the product with no q's asked and get full refund minus installation fees... but i waited 3 months and the workshop said they can only give me back 1/2 of my money... as the original supplier closed shop and disappeared...!!?

The refund is actually given by the workshop who said that they also loss quite a lot from majority customers like me who returned the product and asked for refund...

 

[`Blitz]

My advice is stay away from such product... if it does work, the fuel saving percentage is too small and hardly noticeable...

Better go for NGV which is already in the market for years... Ask the taxi drivers...

 

[donCityZ]

Yeah... but it would probably can work for Carb engine tho.. but even so, the high temperature of Hydrogen burning would definitely melt the engine slowly.. and maybe engine will die prematurely..

im gonnna just wait for Nuclear cell powered engine available, then install that jor lor..