What are our rights? - Can our homes be raided just like this?

[csl]

To answer your question,
1. No. There must be a warrant. If there is no warrant, whatever they find in your house or whomever they find in your house CAN NOT be produced as witness/evidence in court BUT this is malaysia. apa pun boleh.

2. No. Even if they have a warrant for your arrest, they are not supposed to hold your IC and force you to sign anything that you do not want to.

3. No.

4. No. Our laws do not apply to foreigners. They can only inform Indonesian Embassy. They can not arrest him/her for religious laws that only applies to Muslim Malaysians.

5. You can talk to a lawyer about this. The Malaysian Bar Council is a good place to check with. They will help you to defend your rights as a Malaysian who was coerced into doing something that you did not wish to do.

although PDRM 'walk sideways' and the law may not be able to protect you all the time, it is still better for you to talk to a lawyer.

by the way, i am a news editor. if you wish to highlight this matter in the press, i will be happy to help you.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think last time there was a muslim model from Singapore drank beer at Cherating and got caught and sentences for don't know how many canes.

 

[xtremeleo]

Maybe I'm wrong but I think last time there was a muslim model from Singapore drank beer at Cherating and got caught and sentences for don't know how many canes.

she wasnt from singapore sir, she is from perak, and not pahang as stated in the papers. she is (still? i dunno..) working as a nurse in singapore, not a model.

for ur information, she wanted to received the full sentence of 6 sebatan (maximum dat mahkamah syariah may sentence) but all pihak masuk campur (i dunno y people wanna sibuk, dia nak bertaubat tu..) and she wasnt sentence to rotan, but.. to community service? lupa ler..

can u imagine? she, as a muslim wanted to received the full sentence, she knew she did wrong and she was ready to received punishment, i wish i will be like her when my time comes.

err, y are talking about her again? because she is a muslimah?

 

[arturo]

Karthika something something?

i think CSL was trying to say that foregin muslims can still be charged under Malaysian syariah laws...which mizu says they cannot be. by logic, the syariah laws should only apply to locals right?

 

[xtremeleo]

i dunno sir, i didnt study law in uni, but i think our laws (both civil and syariah) shud be able to cover foreigners, or else they can do whatever they want here.. am i making sense? of course there are people granted with immunity, but i dont think karthika and dat indon u mentioned are one of them, no? karthika isnt a singaporean, she is a malaysian btw. many of us have been misled

i humbly apologise for misunderstanding ur point csl

 

[[PIMPIN]]

she wasnt from singapore sir, she is from perak, and not pahang as stated in the papers. she is (still? i dunno..) working as a nurse in singapore, not a model.

for ur information, she wanted to received the full sentence of 6 sebatan (maximum dat mahkamah syariah may sentence) but all pihak masuk campur (i dunno y people wanna sibuk, dia nak bertaubat tu..) and she wasnt sentence to rotan, but.. to community service? lupa ler..

can u imagine? she, as a muslim wanted to received the full sentence, she knew she did wrong and she was ready to received punishment, i wish i will be like her when my time comes.

err, y are talking about her again? because she is a muslimah?

Well, in Islam the whole point is for people to realize what they did was wrong, regret that it ever happened and repent and never sin again. Of course very much easier said than done but if she claims to have repented then I guess punishment is not really necessary because it's between her and Allah.

Plus, her ordeal was deterrent enough and serves as an example for others. To me at least.

Karthika something something?

i think CSL was trying to say that foregin muslims can still be charged under Malaysian syariah laws...which mizu says they cannot be. by logic, the syariah laws should only apply to locals right?

Well, if you travel to anyone's country then aren't you subject to their laws? Americans, etc in Saudi aren't allowed alcohol etc and they aren't even Muslims but this here in Malaysia is a Muslim. Unless she's one of those Indonesians with Malay sounding name but non-Muslim then ok lah.

 

[mizunori77]

no problemo arturo...

i also agree with you guys that it is the 'enforcement' part that is the problem in most cases, and not the regulations.

unfortunately, some of the authorities think that they can get away with rude behaviour, unprofessional conduct and farked up attitude because of their 'badge'.

i encountered 1 case which was worse.

i'm not sure if u guys remember gunasegaran who died in police custody because he kena belasah teruk by the police?

there were 3 witnesses who saw the incident and even testified in court to 'point' out the police officer who brutally attacked gunasegaran.

guess wat happened?

after the court case, a group of 5 plain clothes officers went to ARREST one of the witnesses on the same night.

one of them walloped the witness kao kao in front of wife and 4 kids, and the latest news is that the poor guy who testified against the police has been thrown in jail for 2 years WITHOUT ANY REASON.

he did not kena ISA and the police refused to tell his lawyer what they are charging him for. pity his wife and kids.

this is why i agree with you guys that those authorities always think they can get away with anything as long as they have a badge.

 

[xtremeleo]

they can get away if u dont know who to contact sir, if they know u know what to do and who to contact, they wud be very cautious in their action.. ive never had problems with the authorities so far, as few of them are frens and families, but dat doesnt mean i agree to dis kinda fecking act even if it was for a correct cause. u see, they are trying to prevent maksiat, but they handled the situation in an ugly manner. trust me, harassing people is a sin for us

 

[[PIMPIN]]

xtremeleo - why do you call everyone sir? you seem to do it quite often

 

[xtremeleo]

xtremeleo - why do you call everyone sir? you seem to do it quite often

adoi, iam sorry if it offended u in anyway sir, its a habit i guess.. iam working with a lot of ex air force now, so i think it comes naturally with the job? hahaha

 

[K_Takuya]

Karthika something something?

i think CSL was trying to say that foregin muslims can still be charged under Malaysian syariah laws...which mizu says they cannot be. by logic, the syariah laws should only apply to locals right?

If not mistaken this girl drank alcohol in public, and worse its in the day of fasting month...

 

[FVel]

Sounds pretty f**ked up to me.

There was no warrant.

There were no uniforms present.

You were not arrested because he did not tell you were under arrest and for what charge. You should not have followed them to balai if you were not arrested.

You should not have signed anything. Why open yourself up as a possible accessory, or at the least, a forced witness ?

Nevertheless, what's done is done.

However.........and this perplexes me.........I don't understand why you delay seeing the BAR council whereas you were quick to walk into the lion's den at the religious office for a 'witness' interview. And your bloody housemate begging you to protect his dirty little secret....? ! ?

My 2 cents...Your housemate is not worth it. If his d1ck is itchy, that's his goddamn problem. You get dragged down together with his sordid mess, then what's benefit in it for you ? You get his everlasting gratitude ? Oh please.

Look, just take mizunori's advice and get yourself to the BAR council for their legal opinion. Do it quickly.

Next time you get confronted by these a$$holes, know your rights and don't take any sh1t from them. A stare-down won't do and don't be a smart-arse. Be polite but firm. They push you around because they think you are inexperienced and easymeat. It's unpleasant dealing with power trip cops/officials but unfortunately it happens.

 

[arturo]

FVel...actualy i called the BAR legal aid first thing on Monday morning for advise but was advised against pursuing legal actions. the guys said these cases happen often n said that his own cousin had just gone thru the same thing a week before i called him. he said suing even the guy would just end up with the case being thrown out. about the lion's den, it was on a tuesday n i called them saying i will not attend but they said since i had already signed the witness sepina(just found out it was a form of sepina but from their department) i was obliged to go n have my statement taken. failure to attend would just be escalated with a summons.

i had called the BAR again yesterday(the Johor branch chairman) but was once again told nothing much can be done. the cost of opening a case n the lawyer hours would be wasted since these cases is a sure no win situation. on a sidenote, i have engaged a fren's lawyer for his advise to see if he will be willing to pursue a case based on the happenings. have yet to hear back from him.

on protecting my housemate's marriage, i am not that cruel as to see a person's marriage crumble. i did take the opportunity to advise him to stop this n take it as a sign to be a filial husband n i'd borrow my porn for him instead see how la...i think he is changing ever since what happened.

u were right bout knowing my rights. i've been asking around n trying to find out what are our rights in black n white but enquiries to the BAR have been vague n i've been tai-chi-ed around a few times already. maybe cos these werent the police officers but religious officers. syariah vs civil. not sure the red book applies to these religious officers.

 

[[PIMPIN]]

adoi, iam sorry if it offended u in anyway sir, its a habit i guess.. iam working with a lot of ex air force now, so i think it comes naturally with the job? hahaha

Hahah don't be silly of course not offended. Just that you remind me of my nephew who is a pilot and he tends to address people with a 'sir' at the end of this sentences.

 

[xtremeleo]

hahaha, glad to hear dat sir.. he is a pilot? cool!!

 

[csl]

I think this type of thing must use your wakil rakyat to bring it on to the newspaper. Today another case happen. A wife went converted to muslim and don't know how can get a piece of paper from syariah court or something, bring few people including police escort to the school and took her daughter then disappeared. The daughter all the while stayed with her father, both non muslim (how come muslim law can apply on a non muslim and how come the muslim law can overwrite the Federal law?). KNN, WTF is going on in this country. I'm a Najib supporter but if this type of cases happen and happen again, I think I have no choice but have to vote whatever party that opposes BN, be it PAS or PKR or roket or even independent. We are not in Iran or Iraq. Why wanna make a beautiful and peaceful country become so aggressive like them? Why can bypass all the procedure and just drag someone from somewhere to somewhere? Are we treated like a slave or what?

 

[xtremeleo]

I think this type of thing must use your wakil rakyat to bring it on to the newspaper. Today another case happen. A wife went converted to muslim and don't know how can get a piece of paper from syariah court or something, bring few people including police escort to the school and took her daughter then disappeared. The daughter all the while stayed with her father, both non muslim (how come muslim law can apply on a non muslim and how come the muslim law can overwrite the Federal law?). KNN, WTF is going on in this country. I'm a Najib supporter but if this type of cases happen and happen again, I think I have no choice but have to vote whatever party that opposes BN, be it PAS or PKR or roket or even independent. We are not in Iran or Iraq. Why wanna make a beautiful and peaceful country become so aggressive like them? Why can bypass all the procedure and just drag someone from somewhere to somewhere? Are we treated like a slave or what?

ive never heard of this case sir, any link u can share with us tak? as i remember, when a divorce happens between married couple, then the children automatically go to their mother, dats civil law. at least dats what i remember from previous experience (wasnt me who got divorce..), maybe dats the issue in dis case? reading back, i dont think its an issue of syariah law being put upon a non-muslim, but rather dats the right of the mother imo. can anyone verify dis?

 

[csl]

http://chinapress.com.my/content_new.asp?dt=2010-11-10&sec=malaysia&art=1110mb82.txt

2 non muslim married - got a daughter - separated for 2 years - Daughter followed daddy since both parents' seperation - Wife converted muslim - started the divorce deal on OCT 2010 - wife went to school and took away the daughter - disappeared.

No notice had been sent. Anyone can just go to the court and ask for a paper then do whatever they want without the need of listen to another party. And since daddy and daughter are non muslim, + the wife is just converted, this case should be handled by normal court with federal laws.

I don't know the story behind but even though if the husband got problem, the court must open a case and listen to both parties. Now it is just like license to kidnap. KNN, next time sure got people make fake document, then go to islamic court and take a piece of paper and take someone's children away with police escorted. Today's date is KNN 10 Nov 2010.




改信回教妻子帶走孩子
丈夫：把女兒還我
（大山腳9日訊）昨午在北海光華小學上演“校園爭子案”的孩子父親，今日公開吁請分居兩年且已改信回教的妻子，盡速把孩子歸還給他，直至法庭判決孩子撫養權誰屬為止。

該名父親陳招鴻（36歲）因家庭問題，于2007年11月與妻子分居，這兩年來，7歲女兒皆由男方獨自撫養和照顧，而分居妻子鄺美妃（回教名字FATIMAH FONG BINTI ABDULLAH）也在今年10月申請離婚。

離婚手續未辦妥

他說，沒想到在離婚手續還未辦妥之際，妻子就改信回教，昨午還到學校強行帶走女兒。

由于不滿分居妻子利用回教法庭庭令，在回教法庭官員帶領下，闖入校園把孩子帶走，陳招鴻今日向馬華檳州聯委會公共服務及投訴局主任陳德欽求助，并召開記者會討回公道。

陳招鴻說，他于2001年2月14日，與妻子舉行華人傳統婚禮，并在2003年11月誕下女兒。

他說，他于昨午約5時30分，接獲光華小學家協主席林錦榮來電，馬上趕至學校。當時就讀一年級的女兒，早已被改教信回教且穿著馬來婦女傳統服裝及頭巾的分居妻子，帶上雪州回教法庭的一輛官車。

他見狀馬上趨前與回教法庭官員交涉，同時也向在場警員懇求把孩子還給他。

可是，基于對方持有回教法庭庭令，所以，他無法帶回女兒，只能眼巴巴望著女兒隨回教法庭官員離去。

他說，分居兩年的妻子，是在今年10月3日要求離婚，并向檳城高庭申請辦理離婚手續。

陳德欽：強行帶走欠公平
未離婚雙方都擁撫養權

陳德欽說，根據法律程序，一對分居多年及未辦妥離婚手續的夫妻，都擁有孩子撫養權。

他說，改教信回教的母親與回教法庭官員憑庭令闖校園強行帶走女兒，對男方來說有欠公平。

為了保護被雪州回教法庭官員帶走的孩子的安全，他建議孩子的父親，通過法律管道，向高庭申請人身保護令。

他說，一名非回教徒小女孩，突然被一名改信回教徒者帶走，會對無辜的孩子產生很大的心靈創傷。

他將會把此事呈報給首相署部長拿督斯里納茲里和馬華總部，以協助解決這起風波。

雪回教法庭官員告知
女童母親疑身在加影

獨家報導

闖入校園強行帶走7歲女兒的改信回教婦女，據知，目前藏身在雪州加影。

據其分居兩年的丈夫陳招鴻告訴記者，其女兒被雪州回教法庭官員及分居妻子帶走后，就失去聯絡。

他說，直至今日上午，才聯絡到雪州回教法庭一名官員，并獲告知女兒與母親目前身在加影，但沒有給予明確住址。

他說，他也不確定有關官員所給的地點，是否正確，但他還是希望對方能盡快把其女兒交還給他。

家人促現身交代

鄺美妃家人對于她皈依回教一事，表示不知情，并對此感到驚訝，希望她能現身交代一切，家人愿意給予各方面援助。

記者致電聯絡鄺美妃位于柔佛新山的家人，據家人說，他們是于周一下午接到孩子父親的來電通知，指鄺美妃已改信回教。

“當我們聽到美妃改信回教的消息時，感到萬分驚訝，因為美妃已經3個月沒回家，而改信回教之前也沒有向家人說一聲”。

不愿透露名字的鄺氏家人，也希望鄺美妃能盡快現身，把整個事情說清楚，讓家人了解，而且，家人也愿意給予各方面援助，合力化解整個事件。

 

[arturo]

http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/11/10/nation/7398874&sec=nation

 

[xtremeleo]

thank you for the link sir, i cud read a lil bit, but dont understand most of it, thank you for the translation, appreciate it much sir :)

the court must have a good reason by releasing the consent to go and fetch the daughter, there must be an issue behind dis dat wasnt reported in this paper. the court wont do sumthing like dis without a reason, dont u think so? anything on the father's side? did he lodge a report / complaint, anything? why did the women converted to islam? is there anything about dat written in the news?

 

[csl]

I also hope any court won't do this. But this is not the 1st case. And before this case, you can click page 1. Before page 1, there were thousands of it, reported and not reported.