Kancil tuning

[equin0x]

i dont see their potential to beat a 660T (i dont mean all and i definitely dont mean yours ya). for all i know, the concept of building a 850T is almost the same as plug and play a L2, but a combination of gearbox system, turbocharger system and electronic controller system have to be right in order to unlease the potential of 850T (since it's a custom job and it's not the manufacturer that produce that spec, u have to research to get the spec right for your application)

i hope you agree with me on this

 

[flamefox850]

sorry i mis-read ur statement..i thought u said fail...err fail to perform ah.

yeah..this include my 850t also becos now my boost only 1.1bar..more than that my clutch slip..so i think my car also include in this category.

what u say is true. some people think that "wahh i got 882cc..i can beat all 660cc la like this"..nope it's not true. a very basic 850t will get beaten easily with mid mod 660t.

but as u know shawn, there's a plenty of ways to increase torque/hp..like cooling the intake air, more boost, throw away all backpressure, increase CC and so on. So, having a bigger CC is 1 of those ways. people might think that increasing CC is not worth becos using toooo much money but at a certain level (especially max lvl) u might think that u need to increase the CC becos that's the max hp u can achieve with ur 660t.

like this example :
660t max HP with max mods is 200hp
850t max HP with max mods is 250hp
1000T max HP with max mods is 300hp

(*note : the above statement is just an example but logical)

from my point of view, this is why NSDrag using 1000t platform to achieve at least 278whp for their coconut monster and not 660t platform.

but the most important is money laa. becos low budget 850t will never smoke high budget 660t..never. money power.

this is why my 850t can't beat those 660t monster like janggut or maybe ur car also (this is the truth)

 

[Fluffy]

so basically its all about how deep ur wallet is huh?and not forgetting knowledge and getting experience ppl (equinox and fox) to help.:_:

flamefox : dang,nice vid man..laju..hehe

 

[equin0x]

fluffy, unfornately saying.. yes. money play an important role in it. but money invest wrongly also another problem.

musang on api,
dude dont think we met before right? any chances of u coming down KL? a couple of guys from keiconcept.net are very keen to meet u and ur car, and of coz same goes to me.

yes i agree with u there is plenty of method to increase torque/hp and increasing displacement is one of the method. ok this much very much depending on personal preferences. to me, i still think there is more room to upgrade with a displacement of 660cc, so i would not go to the extend of easy but extensive swapping of 850cc to churn out more power.

put it this way, as a comparison between my 660T and my teammate's 850T, we both generate over 100hp and we both have 120Nm of torque. that's the end figure. the case is, both of us using different gearbox. mine is a stock L2 gearbox where as his is not the L2 gearbox (what gearbox u might be thinking? hehe come KL we show u.. muahaha) both car at 3rd gear on dyno, with mine only can push merely close to 30hp at 3k RPM where as his 850T can push 60hp++ at 3k RPM (the higher displacement producing more torque at lower rev). dont even mention of the torque there.. so to say, we both have different range of powerband (both aim for track usage) and it's very clear u can see what i'm losing at.. (displacement)

anyhow that's not the actual potential of the 850T.. it's going for a proper tuning soon in time next week using management so the outcome i'm expecting would be around 130~140hp at the wheel. i wont reveal the owner here la but i think u would know who he is if on and off u read the updates in keiconcept.net (kantoi aku if that fella read this msg..)

back to that and relate some with money (i hope he doesnt mind this too and yes again, money plays an important role). he rebuilt a whole 882T from scratch and i think the engine rebuilt figure touches above rm10k. so, rm10k to buy such amount of hp/torque, what would u say? there is another dude in keiconcept.net that spent less than RM5k on 660T + bolt ons and get 100hp (i lost count on how much i spent to get that hp so i give another dude as example). let's not comment on this la, it's just personal preferences again. anyway i think i'm going to lose track of what i'm trying to imply.. i better stop here..

but to me, torque is more important than hp. if not mistaken there's a saying "hp sell the car, torque win the game". i still very much emphasize on torque figure.

also, for the fun of it, hereby attached is a dyno chart of 4 different setup of kancil turbo
http://www.keiconcept.net/components/com_simpleboard/uploaded/images/20060318015.jpg

 

[munpeng]

sounds like going for a lower budget L2 turbo would be a less risky move ya? then I shall listen to you guys, coz for a college dude like me, I don't have too much money to spend on bolt on, and I dont know any mechanics who are good at it.

equinox. what's the difference between torque and hp?

 

[flamefox850]

bro shawn : we've met at cmcom track (cct) event at sepang last time but u didn't notice me and my wife there hehe..u can ask lee (ekiddie), he talked to me that time. but i dun bring my car la on that day. i'm afraid if i go to KL again..u won't notice me again wahahaha:_:

shawn, can u get me the details of the dyno graph u shown above ? which car 660t, which is 850t, whose boosting 1.3bar and so on. and i dun see any car got 60hp at 3k rpm on the graph

actually, hp is just a product of torque. torque is the true value to measure how powerfull the engine is but what we feel when we accelerate car is HP. so in order to know where to shift gear is HP lah. more torque means more hp. but if u say MAX hp...it's different story la

p/s: that 850t guy is polytrox right ? hehehehe. send him regards and good luck

 

[equin0x]

foxy,
haha u said it. i didnt reveal who's da 850T owner.

anyway back to that graph, all 4 comparison is from 2 L2 3cylinder powerplant, 1 L5 4cylinder powerplant and 1 L2 4wd dynoed on all 4 wheels. all 4 using 660T block with diff turbo setup only. the green line is from a L5 4 cylinder going at 1bar. the 4wd generate the lowest eventhough it's using the same turbo as the red liner (red liner is doing 1.3bar but 4wd only doing 0.9bar) due to the fact that the hp is distributed to all 4 wheels. ok la, the L5 is long gone now.. replaced by the 850T coz the owner u mentioned above fed up with the performance he can gain from a L5. all the electronic goodies transfered to the 850T project

and regards to the 60hp at 3K RPM, that chart i have not print out yet. that is the result before tuning, and i'm still waiting for the graph once its tuned.

ps: next time if bump to me, dont shy shy la.. i wont eat wan.. ngek ngek ngek..

 

[equin0x]

sounds like going for a lower budget L2 turbo would be a less risky move ya? then I shall listen to you guys, coz for a college dude like me, I don't have too much money to spend on bolt on, and I dont know any mechanics who are good at it.

equinox. what's the difference between torque and hp?

flamefox already answered ur question above :_:

 

[munpeng]

Changed the spark plug to Borsch 4 kaki already, along with the cable, coz since the mechanic said the original one has to be changed, so straight away changed to 4 kaki. No increase in horse power, but the acceleration pedal became more sensitive and more responsive, I guess that's the result of better combustion ya.

Surprised to learn that Perodua is also using the Kayaba absorbers, the front two absorbers spoiled already, changed to new one, along with the absorber mountings, I guess the main problem of the steering vibration while travelling above 100km/h is the absorber mountings, now the vibration is pretty much gone already. This routine service cost me RM600++, kena screwed by father.... A friend said I kena conned already ar, deng. He said the cable shouldn't cost as much as RM125, but I am a regular customer for that service center, didn't think that I would be conned before that, haihh.

Btw, some people said JRD rims are heavier, true or false? coz spotted a nice 13" JRD rim, nice one. Klang is the place to buy your rims? a friend said Klang offer good prices, but it's far from Puchong.

 

[flamefox850]

i'd already compare my rim (MIR brand- taiwan mari) with JRD rim..both 13". what i can say is the JRD rim almost 2 times weight more than my MIR rim.
but i think it's depend on what models also la..maybe JRD got lighter rim but price a little high..perhaps

 

[munpeng]

Bros who have modified your kancil, what bars are you all using? I am considering installing strut bar first, so need some info :) Is there any differences between Zenden and UR? in terms of quality? UR has 4 point, which sounds better, does it work better than 2 point? or I should just install 2 point only as 2 point and 4 point are the same thing only? what to do next after strut bar? rear/front anti-roll? or room bar?

 

[Tohsan]

Bros who have modified your kancil, what bars are you all using? I am considering installing strut bar first, so need some info :) Is there any differences between Zenden and UR? in terms of quality? UR has 4 point, which sounds better, does it work better than 2 point? or I should just install 2 point only as 2 point and 4 point are the same thing only? what to do next after strut bar? rear/front anti-roll? or room bar?

i happen to use both 2 point n 4 point bar before, i felt handling wise 4 point bars is better. Overall all the bar more or less the same,check carefully u will see all the brand is from same factory oni with different sticker. 4 point strut bar give extra protection during small impact for the front. when doing hairpin u will feel ur car with 4 point will point direction more accurately. 2 points is not bad actually, 4 point will be a plus to your car,oni problem it take up a lil bit more of space of the engine cabin.Just my 2 cents being a ex-kancil owner.:regular_smile:

 

[Tohsan]

i'd already compare my rim (MIR brand- taiwan mari) with JRD rim..both 13". what i can say is the JRD rim almost 2 times weight more than my MIR rim.
but i think it's depend on what models also la..maybe JRD got lighter rim but price a little high..perhaps

what can i say JRD rims is the worst rim tat u can find in the market. The reason they end up being oem for our P2 car becos the cost is cheap for P2 and the profit margin is high,statistically it look good on paper for the manufacturer,but for us i dont see any much benefit than getting a sub-standard quality rims which is easily dented and heavy, u can get new jrd rims for rm200 in local tyre shop for kenari car new jrd rims oem somemore. There is so many brand which is so much better than JRD,even the Taiwan rims is much much more stronger than JRD. The so call German technology in JRD rims is all marketing gimmick, there is nothing outstanding about their rims except they are doing copycat work with bad quality material,even local BSA newer rims in the industry is better than JRD. Just my 2 cents for sharing.:regular_smile:

 

[munpeng]

Thanks for telling Tohsan, all brands are from the same factory ya? haha, I'll take note of that.

 

[Tohsan]

mun peng tailo

no problem just sharing what i know oni.:regular_smile:

 

[maxgil05]

Hi guys

Can any tell me where i can buy the cheapest taiwan 13 inch rim and how much the cost to buy 1 set of rim? How much the it cost to buy the rain or good grip tires that fit for 13 inch rims? And what the size of the tires?

Another question about flywheel,
I want to make my flywheel light for my kancil 660, my friend tell me to change kancil 850's flywheel and he say its is lighter than kancil 660's flywheel. Is this true, can any one tell the weight of this two flywheels?

Is it better to skim or change to kancil 850's flywheel?

If is better to skim the original kancil 660's, how much weight should be skimed of the flywheel?

:regular_smile:

 

[Fluffy]

do remember..when u skim ur flywheel u will get a good climb in revs and also drops.

 

[munpeng]

Serious question: Any experienced bro can help me explain what K&N filter is? I am not sure, it's for carb engine right? it's something like drop-in? if I am going to install filter to my kancil, what would be the suitable choice?

:)

 

[Tohsan]

Serious question: Any experienced bro can help me explain what K&N filter is? I am not sure, it's for carb engine right? it's something like drop-in? if I am going to install filter to my kancil, what would be the suitable choice?

:)

u have 3 choice:

1.KNN drop-in filter like the stock type.
2.KNN Open Pod filter.
3.Cold Air Intake.

:regular_smile:

 

[Fluffy]

for a carby..i would prefer a open pod.:_: