let u know later..cheers
Insulation!!
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Installed...1 roll of aluminium backed bitumen flashing tape of size 30' x 3", UK made so quality is good with some good heat resistant qualities since it's used as roof waterproofing... 
That's equivalent to 7.5 sq ft of bitumen sheet, about 2mm thick. I started with the boot, since I was not sure of the adhesive properties of the flashing strip. 7.5 sq ft covers both wheel arches, and the two shelves left and right of the spare tyre wheel well. My wheel well already has a layer of bitumen, installed by me a couple of years ago to dampen the noise coming out of it since I don't carry a spare tyre. So, to cover the whole boot, you'd probably need 2 rolls. Not too bad since each roll only costs about RM 30. A roll would definitely cover two doors. So...RM 50 to install some decent dampening sheets in your boot at 100% coverage...which is not necessary since some parts of the boot do not actually resonate...
The adhesive properties of this bitumen is actually quite good. You have to be careful cos once you lay it down, it's difficult to take off in one piece. I reckon it's a bit softer than dynamat or raamat, but properly installed, it should "cure" in about a month to match the physical properties of any structured bitumen.
Laying down 3" strips has it's pro's and con's...
Pro...it's easy to make it conform to any shape in the car cos basically you can stretch and bend the strips.
Con...it takes longer as you have to cut many, many strips to line your boot. For you young, fit guys, this should not be a problem, but for a feilo like me...not only is it murder on the back...it's bloody difficult to squeeze into the boot, even one as large as the feilo's... :sad_smile:
I also reckon the material's a little thinner than dynamat or raammat, so the dampening properties will be less. BUT then again...there is a heck of difference between RM 4 per sq foot, and RM 11 - 17 per sq foot (as is the price of raammat or dynamat). The good thing about this is that different parts of the car have different degrees of resonance. So, you could probably get away with decent sound dampening with a single layer in most areas, but for those places that need more dampening, just apply a second layer. It would be best to lay the second layer at right angles across the first in a cross-hash pattern in order to improve the structural properties of the bitumen layers. One good place to have some extra dampening will be the driver's side of the boot...above the exhaust. Do not apply this to the speaker shelf...as that is exposed to the sun and would tend to heat up enough to soften the bitumen.
Both the left and right fenders or panels already have factory installed sound supression pads...the type that looks like carpet underlay. If you intend to replace this, then I suggest you peel it off and give the panel a good cleaning before you try. Mine was damn dusty. Don't try to seal them in with bitumen, cos all you will be doing is lessening the surface area for contact and adhesion. For these panels, I don't intend to use bitumen as I believe that would be an overkill.
I've also purchased a goodly supply of 6mm and 9mm Insuflex sheets. This is a material similar to Superlon. Both are used extensively in commercial air-conditioning as insulating and sound-proofing material. Being closely connected to the industry, I bought at wholesale price, and now have enough to insulate the whole car if I want to. Insuflex is what I intend to use on those panels.
After I complete the bitumen layer, I will lay 1 layer of 9mm Insuflex on top of the bitumen before I reinstall my custom MDF boot panels. The boot plastic mouldings will also be lined with Insuflex, as well as the left and right boot frames.
The boot lid is another issue. I am stumped as to how to remove the board under the panel without damaging it.
Tomorrow, when I drive to work with an empty boot, devoid of panelling, mouldings or carpeting of any kind, I'll be able to hear if the layering has worked.
That's equivalent to 7.5 sq ft of bitumen sheet, about 2mm thick. I started with the boot, since I was not sure of the adhesive properties of the flashing strip. 7.5 sq ft covers both wheel arches, and the two shelves left and right of the spare tyre wheel well. My wheel well already has a layer of bitumen, installed by me a couple of years ago to dampen the noise coming out of it since I don't carry a spare tyre. So, to cover the whole boot, you'd probably need 2 rolls. Not too bad since each roll only costs about RM 30. A roll would definitely cover two doors. So...RM 50 to install some decent dampening sheets in your boot at 100% coverage...which is not necessary since some parts of the boot do not actually resonate...
The adhesive properties of this bitumen is actually quite good. You have to be careful cos once you lay it down, it's difficult to take off in one piece. I reckon it's a bit softer than dynamat or raamat, but properly installed, it should "cure" in about a month to match the physical properties of any structured bitumen.
Laying down 3" strips has it's pro's and con's...
Pro...it's easy to make it conform to any shape in the car cos basically you can stretch and bend the strips.
Con...it takes longer as you have to cut many, many strips to line your boot. For you young, fit guys, this should not be a problem, but for a feilo like me...not only is it murder on the back...it's bloody difficult to squeeze into the boot, even one as large as the feilo's... :sad_smile:
I also reckon the material's a little thinner than dynamat or raammat, so the dampening properties will be less. BUT then again...there is a heck of difference between RM 4 per sq foot, and RM 11 - 17 per sq foot (as is the price of raammat or dynamat). The good thing about this is that different parts of the car have different degrees of resonance. So, you could probably get away with decent sound dampening with a single layer in most areas, but for those places that need more dampening, just apply a second layer. It would be best to lay the second layer at right angles across the first in a cross-hash pattern in order to improve the structural properties of the bitumen layers. One good place to have some extra dampening will be the driver's side of the boot...above the exhaust. Do not apply this to the speaker shelf...as that is exposed to the sun and would tend to heat up enough to soften the bitumen.
Both the left and right fenders or panels already have factory installed sound supression pads...the type that looks like carpet underlay. If you intend to replace this, then I suggest you peel it off and give the panel a good cleaning before you try. Mine was damn dusty. Don't try to seal them in with bitumen, cos all you will be doing is lessening the surface area for contact and adhesion. For these panels, I don't intend to use bitumen as I believe that would be an overkill.
I've also purchased a goodly supply of 6mm and 9mm Insuflex sheets. This is a material similar to Superlon. Both are used extensively in commercial air-conditioning as insulating and sound-proofing material. Being closely connected to the industry, I bought at wholesale price, and now have enough to insulate the whole car if I want to. Insuflex is what I intend to use on those panels.
After I complete the bitumen layer, I will lay 1 layer of 9mm Insuflex on top of the bitumen before I reinstall my custom MDF boot panels. The boot plastic mouldings will also be lined with Insuflex, as well as the left and right boot frames.
The boot lid is another issue. I am stumped as to how to remove the board under the panel without damaging it.
Tomorrow, when I drive to work with an empty boot, devoid of panelling, mouldings or carpeting of any kind, I'll be able to hear if the layering has worked.
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Oh...btw...the air con contractors tell me that Insuflex is better than superlon for soundproofing applications.
Also, when laying bitumen strips on non-horizontal surfaces or oddly shaped surfaces, I've discovered that it's easier to cut them into 6" lengths and "assemble" them like a jigsaw puzzle.
Also, when laying bitumen strips on non-horizontal surfaces or oddly shaped surfaces, I've discovered that it's easier to cut them into 6" lengths and "assemble" them like a jigsaw puzzle.
deffy...sounds like good stuffs...defcon1 said:
but i am sorry coz still havent got the pricin from my customers. no time to meet them yet...
but i still have some raammat left...slightly over 8.5 feet...rm100 nia..want?
p/s: u have pm as well..
ok...will bring it to u together with the door hinges..owe me rm220...defcon1 said:I want!!!...
defcon1 said:
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defcon1 said:Heh..."The School of Crock"...
Definition...
"Especially in engineering, a crock is a botched attempt or design to achieve something. An automobile with intentionally designed square wheels would be a crock."
The latest report from THE SCHOOL OF CROCK...
The RM 3.50 per sq ft bitumin flashing tape is doing it's job. Yesterday I drove to work with only the bitumin installed. No panels or moulding installed in the boot. The sound dampening was distinct. It wasn't so much that it was quiet, but the sound was softened and not harsh.
Yesterday, I installed the Insuflex insulation sheets. I hardly had time to measure everything since I got back home late again. The biggest headache was cutting out the shapes for the sidewalls. But Insuflex is pretty forgiving...you can basically stretch and squeeze it in. Still, it wasn't a neat job. Dunlop rubber glue is messy stuff. For vertical surfaces, it makes sense to get self-adhesive forms of damping materials. My only consolation was that all this would be hidden under mouldings and panels later...
The off-cuts, I just painted glue on and stuck them on any surface still exposed. You have to be careful to mark the holes for the moulding clips and cut holes in the Insuflex to allow you to re-attach the side mouldings later.
This morning, I drove to work with only the bitumen and Insuflex installed. The rear of the car is much quieter now. But now, the noises from the front become much more distinct. Well, luckily I bought enough Insuflex for the whole car... :)
Tonight, I reinstall the side mouldings and my MDF floor panels. The mouldings, other than being themselves sound dampening in nature, should lightly compress the Insuflex, thereby improving it's sound damping properties.
My MDF floor panels are made of...er...MDF. MDF, although fairly homogenous, tends to be a very noisy material if not bolted down properly. Being a reasonably rigid material, and consisting of large flat surfaces, they also tend to resonate and contribute to audio deterioration.
I've already cut out the forms of the 3 pieces that make up my floor panel. I intend to glue the Insuflex behind them so that when I put them back in, they will form another insulating layer. Tonight, we'll see. After this...the speaker panel behind the rear seats will receive a layer of Insuflex under it.
I'll let you guys know later what happened.
I'll be out of town for a few days, so I'll log in and post when I can...
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This is my final post before the holidays...
The boot insulation project has been a success. Despite the rush job, working only after I got home...circa 9 pm every night, the job was complete in 3 nights. The bitumen strips are working and the insuflex does what it is supposed to do. The rear of my car is now absolutely quiet...
Because I used bitumen strips of only 3" width, laying them down took some time. However, on the plus side, when laying on non-horizontal surfaces, should anything come loose, it doesn't drag everything else down with it...
Insuflex is, however, a bit more difficult. Because it didn't come self-adhesive, rubber gum takes time to use, and it forces you to cut smaller pieces of insuflex and piece them together like a jigsaw puzzle. The sound-proofing, however, is very good.
Total cost of sound proofing our boot...
2 rolls of bitumen strips @ $ 28 per roll = $56
3 sheets of Insuflex (3' x 4') @ $ 15 per sheet = $45 (I double layered it...on top of car floorboard and under my MDF floorboard, else you'd only need 2 sheets at most.
...about RM 100 to do the job...which is probably about a third what it would cost using "traditional" materials...
...next...doors and passenger compartment floorboards...
The boot insulation project has been a success. Despite the rush job, working only after I got home...circa 9 pm every night, the job was complete in 3 nights. The bitumen strips are working and the insuflex does what it is supposed to do. The rear of my car is now absolutely quiet...
Because I used bitumen strips of only 3" width, laying them down took some time. However, on the plus side, when laying on non-horizontal surfaces, should anything come loose, it doesn't drag everything else down with it...
Insuflex is, however, a bit more difficult. Because it didn't come self-adhesive, rubber gum takes time to use, and it forces you to cut smaller pieces of insuflex and piece them together like a jigsaw puzzle. The sound-proofing, however, is very good.
Total cost of sound proofing our boot...
2 rolls of bitumen strips @ $ 28 per roll = $56
3 sheets of Insuflex (3' x 4') @ $ 15 per sheet = $45 (I double layered it...on top of car floorboard and under my MDF floorboard, else you'd only need 2 sheets at most.
...about RM 100 to do the job...which is probably about a third what it would cost using "traditional" materials...
...next...doors and passenger compartment floorboards...
should have some pics la bro...
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Ok...this coming weekend, I'll complete the floorboards, and I think, the two front doors.
After working with the bitumen flash strips for a while, I've come to the conclusion that it works well on parts of the car the don't heat up, whereas, on the parts that do, you WILL want to use some better material.
Hence, Bitumen strips you would use on...
a) Boot area but make sure you layer over it with Insuflex or some equivalent material to soak up anything that may ooze out expecially above the muffler.
b) Rear wheel wells - ok. also layer with Insuflex.
c) Rear seats - you might not have the space to layer with insuflex. But there is already a bitumen sheet there (factory applied), so you only need to dampen around it, if necessary.
d) Floorboards up to the pedals - no problems here. Insuflex layering will definitely help. Make sure you cut holes for all the difficult areas like the rails for the front seats, etc. You may want to avoid layering areas where the original plastic mouldings meet the body as it will be darn difficult to get the mouldings back in place again.
For the firewall, and doors, you will probably want to use better material. I cannot anticipate 2 things...
a) That the bitumin will continue to stick even when the firewall or skin of the car door is hot. 50 degrees C is probably still ok. 60 degrees C is pushing it. Even though the material is rated to 80 degrees C, I don't feel like using my car for a test vehicle, considering that if it fails, I'm the one who is going to have to clean it up...
b) How hot the firewall or skin will heat up to under various conditions. Don't forget...when you stick bitumin eg. on the outer skin of the door, you also compromise the heat radiating capacity of the door material itself, so it will probably "pool" heat in the metal. A car door in mid-afternoon sunlight could possibly reach 55 degrees C or more.
So, I've finally called Grexer and ordered half a roll of Raammat, which should allow me to do 4 doors and the non-horizontal part of the firewall.
I'll let you know how it is.
After working with the bitumen flash strips for a while, I've come to the conclusion that it works well on parts of the car the don't heat up, whereas, on the parts that do, you WILL want to use some better material.
Hence, Bitumen strips you would use on...
a) Boot area but make sure you layer over it with Insuflex or some equivalent material to soak up anything that may ooze out expecially above the muffler.
b) Rear wheel wells - ok. also layer with Insuflex.
c) Rear seats - you might not have the space to layer with insuflex. But there is already a bitumen sheet there (factory applied), so you only need to dampen around it, if necessary.
d) Floorboards up to the pedals - no problems here. Insuflex layering will definitely help. Make sure you cut holes for all the difficult areas like the rails for the front seats, etc. You may want to avoid layering areas where the original plastic mouldings meet the body as it will be darn difficult to get the mouldings back in place again.
For the firewall, and doors, you will probably want to use better material. I cannot anticipate 2 things...
a) That the bitumin will continue to stick even when the firewall or skin of the car door is hot. 50 degrees C is probably still ok. 60 degrees C is pushing it. Even though the material is rated to 80 degrees C, I don't feel like using my car for a test vehicle, considering that if it fails, I'm the one who is going to have to clean it up...
b) How hot the firewall or skin will heat up to under various conditions. Don't forget...when you stick bitumin eg. on the outer skin of the door, you also compromise the heat radiating capacity of the door material itself, so it will probably "pool" heat in the metal. A car door in mid-afternoon sunlight could possibly reach 55 degrees C or more.
So, I've finally called Grexer and ordered half a roll of Raammat, which should allow me to do 4 doors and the non-horizontal part of the firewall.
I'll let you know how it is.
way to go chris...
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Floorboards done. Front doors done...
My first observation on the installation...it's not easy. Especially if your car's in the sun... :sad_smile:
I got up around 9am...and managed to get to Lee's (my mech) place at around 9.40 am. Needed to do this cos there just wasn't enough space to work at my place considering my open house in the evening. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to get a completely covered working area. So, half covered was the best I could do, and at least the car doors would open completely to provide max access to the car's interior.
As I had morning coffee with Lee, his guys (no customers at the time) stripped the interior for me...seats, mouldings, etc. Seats are pretty easy...same as any other car...but the carpeting is irritating. It's designed to be put in before you put in the centre console...i.e. both the left and right sides are joined under the dash...so unless I wanted a nightmare in audio wiring, I'd have to find a way to do the car without taking out the carpet entirely... :sad_smile:
Solved this problem by folding the carpet over from right to left and left to right, doing the car one half at a time.
The next thing you notice is that the floorboards already have original bitumen pads of about 5mm thickness. Good stuff, but slightly hardened and they don't completely cover the floorboards nor all the flat panels. Plus, there is about 1cm of insulation material - the usual carpet/blanket looking type. These are good, and should not be thrown away, but laid back after after you lay your insulation materials.
One last thing. Since the interior is empty, you might as well take the opportunity to take off the original rear speaker board, apply the bitumen to the metal panel and lay a 9 mm layer of insuflex on it. Improves your sound significantly. For this part of the car, you will want to use either Raammat or Dynamat, as it is hot.
On my car...I had another irritation...1/2" of water under the passenger side of the car!!! Two things had happened...
a) My a/c box had started leaking. Had to have it serviced...
b) The bloody repair on the car after the accident I had...the silly guys had taken off the rubber tabs blocking the holes in the floorboards and didn't put them on again. So, at high speeds, in rain...water was forced through into the cabin. No wonder my car always smelled funny. And I thought it was "Essence of Deffy"...
Needless to say, the original insulation material in that part of the car was soaked through, and after a brief assessment, we decided to strip them out and throw them away. It would have taken too long to dry them out again...
By the time I started work, it was about 10.30 am, and the sun was in it's full glory. Lee's customers were treated to the sight of this rather large individual sweating bullets and trying to squeeze himself into the smaller corners of a ceffy in some weird ritual which involved a lot of grunting and cursing...
As I'd almost run out of flashing tape (1 roll left), I used Raammat to line the floorboards, and flashing tape to do the sides and centre. I ran the bitumen from the back seat (just above the vertical part of the chasis before the fuel pump access panel) till the firewall...as far as I could reach. For this part of the car, I'd suggest 2 layers if you can afford it. One already does the job, but two would be better. On top of this, I lay 9mm Insuflex. No need to glue on. Just cut to shape avoiding the "frame" part of the chasis, and lay them flat. You might want to glue down the front edge (on the firewall), but that's about it. I didn't even bother to go up the rear seat support with this as it would have taken too much space and made refitting the carpets too difficult. Be careful NOT to cover up your wiring with bitumen as this would make future repairs or checking difficult. Covering with Insuflex is ok (if you don't glue them on).
Now...at the rear seat, there is a large metal panel separating the passenger cabin and the boot. Doing this bit is optional, but I would go ahead and apply a layer of bitumen on it as it does resonate a little. As you have a very thick piece of foam on it (i.e. your seat), it makes little difference. You might detect a slightly better sound quality coming from your speakers.
I left it for another time, as by then, I had lost about 3 kgs of water (replaced with 5kg's of 100 plus), my sugar level was alarming low, my nicotine level was dangerously high, I'd run out of 4-letter words to mouth, and I smelled... :shocked:
After you get the bitumen and insuflex properly laid down, just relay the original insulation material and cover up again with your carpeting. Re-install your seats and interior mouldings, and you're done. Careful with all your clips and clip on mouldings.
The process is more tedious than difficult. And doing it in the sun...is a masochist's dream, but a nightmare to most other people. The only good thing about it is that I didn't have to apply a heat gun as the bitumen was softening at roughly the same rate as I was dehydrating...
One IMPORTANT observation...the Raammat was softening at roughly the same rate as my flashing strip further strengthening my belief that some grades of flashing tape could be used to lower the overall cost of doing up a car. I'd confidently say that the boot, and all the horizontal parts of the floorboards could safely be layered with flashing strip. BUT, flashing strip is also roughly half the thickness of Raammat. So, you WILL have to use 2 layers to get the same effect.
The total process of doing up the floorboards alone...probably about 5 hours for our cars. Add 2 hours if your car is in the sun...
By the time I'd finished, I was too tired to test anything. Lee was still fiddling with my door hinges, so he lent me his car to go home and delivered my car later. Now, those of you who've met Lee and his wife (who works with him at the workshop) will know that he is roughly a third my size, and drives a Kancil/Mira turbo... :shocked:
Squeezing my rather generous behind into a Kancil was another totally new experience for me. For starters, my behind got jammed between the seat and the steering wheel, requiring me to reach down under the seat to move it backwards. Now, us feilos are not generally very flexible...but when you are caught in this embarrassing situation...in public...you find ways...
The doors...will be in my next post...
My first observation on the installation...it's not easy. Especially if your car's in the sun... :sad_smile:
I got up around 9am...and managed to get to Lee's (my mech) place at around 9.40 am. Needed to do this cos there just wasn't enough space to work at my place considering my open house in the evening. Unfortunately, I wasn't able to get a completely covered working area. So, half covered was the best I could do, and at least the car doors would open completely to provide max access to the car's interior.
As I had morning coffee with Lee, his guys (no customers at the time) stripped the interior for me...seats, mouldings, etc. Seats are pretty easy...same as any other car...but the carpeting is irritating. It's designed to be put in before you put in the centre console...i.e. both the left and right sides are joined under the dash...so unless I wanted a nightmare in audio wiring, I'd have to find a way to do the car without taking out the carpet entirely... :sad_smile:
Solved this problem by folding the carpet over from right to left and left to right, doing the car one half at a time.
The next thing you notice is that the floorboards already have original bitumen pads of about 5mm thickness. Good stuff, but slightly hardened and they don't completely cover the floorboards nor all the flat panels. Plus, there is about 1cm of insulation material - the usual carpet/blanket looking type. These are good, and should not be thrown away, but laid back after after you lay your insulation materials.
One last thing. Since the interior is empty, you might as well take the opportunity to take off the original rear speaker board, apply the bitumen to the metal panel and lay a 9 mm layer of insuflex on it. Improves your sound significantly. For this part of the car, you will want to use either Raammat or Dynamat, as it is hot.
On my car...I had another irritation...1/2" of water under the passenger side of the car!!! Two things had happened...
a) My a/c box had started leaking. Had to have it serviced...
b) The bloody repair on the car after the accident I had...the silly guys had taken off the rubber tabs blocking the holes in the floorboards and didn't put them on again. So, at high speeds, in rain...water was forced through into the cabin. No wonder my car always smelled funny. And I thought it was "Essence of Deffy"...
Needless to say, the original insulation material in that part of the car was soaked through, and after a brief assessment, we decided to strip them out and throw them away. It would have taken too long to dry them out again...
By the time I started work, it was about 10.30 am, and the sun was in it's full glory. Lee's customers were treated to the sight of this rather large individual sweating bullets and trying to squeeze himself into the smaller corners of a ceffy in some weird ritual which involved a lot of grunting and cursing...
As I'd almost run out of flashing tape (1 roll left), I used Raammat to line the floorboards, and flashing tape to do the sides and centre. I ran the bitumen from the back seat (just above the vertical part of the chasis before the fuel pump access panel) till the firewall...as far as I could reach. For this part of the car, I'd suggest 2 layers if you can afford it. One already does the job, but two would be better. On top of this, I lay 9mm Insuflex. No need to glue on. Just cut to shape avoiding the "frame" part of the chasis, and lay them flat. You might want to glue down the front edge (on the firewall), but that's about it. I didn't even bother to go up the rear seat support with this as it would have taken too much space and made refitting the carpets too difficult. Be careful NOT to cover up your wiring with bitumen as this would make future repairs or checking difficult. Covering with Insuflex is ok (if you don't glue them on).
Now...at the rear seat, there is a large metal panel separating the passenger cabin and the boot. Doing this bit is optional, but I would go ahead and apply a layer of bitumen on it as it does resonate a little. As you have a very thick piece of foam on it (i.e. your seat), it makes little difference. You might detect a slightly better sound quality coming from your speakers.
I left it for another time, as by then, I had lost about 3 kgs of water (replaced with 5kg's of 100 plus), my sugar level was alarming low, my nicotine level was dangerously high, I'd run out of 4-letter words to mouth, and I smelled... :shocked:
After you get the bitumen and insuflex properly laid down, just relay the original insulation material and cover up again with your carpeting. Re-install your seats and interior mouldings, and you're done. Careful with all your clips and clip on mouldings.
The process is more tedious than difficult. And doing it in the sun...is a masochist's dream, but a nightmare to most other people. The only good thing about it is that I didn't have to apply a heat gun as the bitumen was softening at roughly the same rate as I was dehydrating...
One IMPORTANT observation...the Raammat was softening at roughly the same rate as my flashing strip further strengthening my belief that some grades of flashing tape could be used to lower the overall cost of doing up a car. I'd confidently say that the boot, and all the horizontal parts of the floorboards could safely be layered with flashing strip. BUT, flashing strip is also roughly half the thickness of Raammat. So, you WILL have to use 2 layers to get the same effect.
The total process of doing up the floorboards alone...probably about 5 hours for our cars. Add 2 hours if your car is in the sun...
By the time I'd finished, I was too tired to test anything. Lee was still fiddling with my door hinges, so he lent me his car to go home and delivered my car later. Now, those of you who've met Lee and his wife (who works with him at the workshop) will know that he is roughly a third my size, and drives a Kancil/Mira turbo... :shocked:
Squeezing my rather generous behind into a Kancil was another totally new experience for me. For starters, my behind got jammed between the seat and the steering wheel, requiring me to reach down under the seat to move it backwards. Now, us feilos are not generally very flexible...but when you are caught in this embarrassing situation...in public...you find ways...
The doors...will be in my next post...
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Doing the doors...
After my rather interesting Saturday of healthy sauna and stretching excercises, followed by entertaining about 120 guests in the evening...I was completely wasted by midnight...but I did manage to wake up by 9 am on Sunday to complete the job.
Dragging my weary and aching bulk out of bed, I decided to get an early start on the grunting and cursing that usually goes hand in hand with my work on the car...
On Sunday, I was a living testament that too much of a good thing will kill you. Sauna and stretching is all very good...in moderation...but 7 hours of it WILL kill you.
After gently brushing my teeth (I could swear that even they ached), and washing up, I gingerly made my way downstairs...taking the stairs one step at a time...and practically hobbled my way into the kitchen to look for breakfast. One very important thing to remember...a very strong, hot cup of coffee the morning after you do your soundproofing...is mandatory and a life saver...
Sitting with my hot coffee in my hands...and a light breakfast already despatched...I assessed my aches and pains whilst trying to decide if I should take the doors apart. My desire for a quiet car and better audio performance won over my assessment of aches and pains. Finally...consoling myself with the thought that if I still ache, that means that there must still be some muscle in there somewhere since fat doesn't ache... ... I made my way to my car with some no. 10 spanners and my screwdriver set.
Taking the door apart is easy.
1. Take off the plastic moulding behind the door opening handle. It's clipped on so just insert a screwdriver under it and ply out.
2. Then, take off the handgrip on the arm-rest (the little cup that you use to close the door). There is a plastic tab at the bottom hiding a screw under it. Just insert a small screwdriver under the tab, flick it off, and unscrew the cup.
3. There are 2 screws on the lower part of the door moulding. Take these off.
4. You should also take out the courtesy light as the wire clip inside is difficult to clip back on if the light is still attached to the door moulding. Just flip off the cover with a small flat screwdriver, undo the 2 screws that hold it, and unclip the wire behind it.
Once these are off, the door moulding is held by 4 clips. Just unclip, unplug the wires going to your door switches, and remove the moulding.
Moulding off...stow it away somewhere where it won't get damaged...inside, there is a metal handle (the metal piece that goes into your arm-rest in the door moulding) that has to come off. It's secured by 4 screws and isn't too tightly screwed on. With this handle off, the entire plastic sheet that protects the car moulding from moisture can come off leaving the door bare.
You will need to clean the inside of the door. Some people just clean with thinner or petrol. I cleaned out the dust with a bucket of soapy water and a cloth first. Then let it dry, and one last cleaning with thinner before apply the bitumen. You will want to ensure that the flat outer skin of the car is completely clean so that the bitumen will adhere properly to the surface.
The holes in the door look large, but considering the thickness of my arm, it wasn't easy applying the bitumen. Best way is to apply in pieces. Cut 2 pieces for the bottom left and right, then 2 pieces more for the top left and right. You don't really need full 100% coverage, so don't worry about small areas still uncovered. After apply the bitumen as best as you can and pressing them down firmly to ensure that they will stick and stay, do one more important thing.
The front dor speaker is screwed into a speaker moulding on the door. Remove this moulding and applly a layer of Raammat behind it on the door frame (door frame is the layer INSIDE the car, the skin is the outer layer). You will want to cover all the metal in that area of the door on the INSIDE. Cut out the speaker hole, and punch through the screw holes again to make reinstalling the speaker moulding easier. Reinstall the speaker moulding and make sure you get your speaker polarity right when you plug back in the wires. This will improve your speakers' performance tremendously.
Insuflex - I used 6mm Insuflex to cover the upper half of the door moulding, on the inside that is to be in contact with the door frame. The lower half of the moulding is rather tight and 6mm of Insuflex would have made it almost impossible for the clips to clip in again.
Once done, reinstall the door moulding...in reverse sequence to how you removed it, and you're done. Total job can be done in 2 - 3 hours and the effect is distinct.
Results in next post...
After my rather interesting Saturday of healthy sauna and stretching excercises, followed by entertaining about 120 guests in the evening...I was completely wasted by midnight...but I did manage to wake up by 9 am on Sunday to complete the job.
Dragging my weary and aching bulk out of bed, I decided to get an early start on the grunting and cursing that usually goes hand in hand with my work on the car...
On Sunday, I was a living testament that too much of a good thing will kill you. Sauna and stretching is all very good...in moderation...but 7 hours of it WILL kill you.
After gently brushing my teeth (I could swear that even they ached), and washing up, I gingerly made my way downstairs...taking the stairs one step at a time...and practically hobbled my way into the kitchen to look for breakfast. One very important thing to remember...a very strong, hot cup of coffee the morning after you do your soundproofing...is mandatory and a life saver...
Sitting with my hot coffee in my hands...and a light breakfast already despatched...I assessed my aches and pains whilst trying to decide if I should take the doors apart. My desire for a quiet car and better audio performance won over my assessment of aches and pains. Finally...consoling myself with the thought that if I still ache, that means that there must still be some muscle in there somewhere since fat doesn't ache...
... I made my way to my car with some no. 10 spanners and my screwdriver set.Taking the door apart is easy.
1. Take off the plastic moulding behind the door opening handle. It's clipped on so just insert a screwdriver under it and ply out.
2. Then, take off the handgrip on the arm-rest (the little cup that you use to close the door). There is a plastic tab at the bottom hiding a screw under it. Just insert a small screwdriver under the tab, flick it off, and unscrew the cup.
3. There are 2 screws on the lower part of the door moulding. Take these off.
4. You should also take out the courtesy light as the wire clip inside is difficult to clip back on if the light is still attached to the door moulding. Just flip off the cover with a small flat screwdriver, undo the 2 screws that hold it, and unclip the wire behind it.
Once these are off, the door moulding is held by 4 clips. Just unclip, unplug the wires going to your door switches, and remove the moulding.
Moulding off...stow it away somewhere where it won't get damaged...inside, there is a metal handle (the metal piece that goes into your arm-rest in the door moulding) that has to come off. It's secured by 4 screws and isn't too tightly screwed on. With this handle off, the entire plastic sheet that protects the car moulding from moisture can come off leaving the door bare.
You will need to clean the inside of the door. Some people just clean with thinner or petrol. I cleaned out the dust with a bucket of soapy water and a cloth first. Then let it dry, and one last cleaning with thinner before apply the bitumen. You will want to ensure that the flat outer skin of the car is completely clean so that the bitumen will adhere properly to the surface.
The holes in the door look large, but considering the thickness of my arm, it wasn't easy applying the bitumen. Best way is to apply in pieces. Cut 2 pieces for the bottom left and right, then 2 pieces more for the top left and right. You don't really need full 100% coverage, so don't worry about small areas still uncovered. After apply the bitumen as best as you can and pressing them down firmly to ensure that they will stick and stay, do one more important thing.
The front dor speaker is screwed into a speaker moulding on the door. Remove this moulding and applly a layer of Raammat behind it on the door frame (door frame is the layer INSIDE the car, the skin is the outer layer). You will want to cover all the metal in that area of the door on the INSIDE. Cut out the speaker hole, and punch through the screw holes again to make reinstalling the speaker moulding easier. Reinstall the speaker moulding and make sure you get your speaker polarity right when you plug back in the wires. This will improve your speakers' performance tremendously.
Insuflex - I used 6mm Insuflex to cover the upper half of the door moulding, on the inside that is to be in contact with the door frame. The lower half of the moulding is rather tight and 6mm of Insuflex would have made it almost impossible for the clips to clip in again.
Once done, reinstall the door moulding...in reverse sequence to how you removed it, and you're done. Total job can be done in 2 - 3 hours and the effect is distinct.
Results in next post...
deffy...can publish a book liow...HOW TO DIY YOUR A32?
- Joined
- May 26, 2006
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The results... <insert drum roll here>...
The noise level in the car is significantly reduced. How much is hard to say since my ears have never been calibrated by Sirim, but let me describe the effect and we will venture a guess later...
a) Before soundproofing, the most distinct sound in the car was my muffler. This was because of the addition of a Y-pipe and the replacement of the stock centre silencer with a bullet. The sound was a low growl that used to fill the cabin.
b) After soundproofing the boot area, this exhaust sound was greatly reduced. I would venture that the level of this sound went down by at least 60% - 70%. At that time, and this was confirmed by Ong, that most of the noise now came from my floorboards, slightly in front of the front seats.
c) After this last bit of work, i.e. floorboards and front doors, the sound level in front has been greatly reduced and the most distinct sound(s) in the car are now split between the muffler and the front firewall. I used not to be able to hear my signal light relay clicking...now I hear it distinctly. Mostly, I can now hear my tyres.
Street noise is also greatly reduced. Passing motorbikes no longer rattle my rear view mirror. Passing cars hardly register.
When the car goes over bumps, it used to send a distinct "clunk" through the frame of the car. Now, the car appears smoother, less vibrations, and the "clunk" that usually follows going over imperfections in the road has been reduced to a "dub"...almost like a new car. A lot of irritating clicks and squeeks have also dissapeared. Overall the chasis feels firmer.
The overal level of vibrations going through the frame of the car, and felt by the driver through the steering, feet and behind are reduced by at least two-thirds.
Conclusion : I would estimate the noise reduction level is in the region of about 70%. Doubling the bitumen on the floorboards and firewall would probably have resulted in about a 5% better performance, so you will have to decide for yourself if this is economically viable.
Noise coming through the firewall is probably because I only layered about half-way up the firewall. In order to do the entire firewall, I would have had to take off the dash...which is not the kind of thing that a casual diy'er would want to do as it would probably take you 2 - 3 days to take it off and put it back on again. The solution I will probably try to take might be to improve the soundproofing of the bonnet, and maybe the upper firewall in the engine bay. I'm still considering the type of material to use for this.
I suspect the muffler sounds coming from the back will be improved by soundproofing the rear doors (which I left for another day), and the metal bulkhead separating the passenger compartment from the boot. There is also the possibility that the metal under the rear seat needs another layer of bitumen. This might be the next weekend's project.
The tyres, however, will be another problem entirely. Some people go so far as to dampen the entire mudguard (above the plastic wheel-well mouldings), but as this is an external part of the car, application of the bitumen has to be very proper with really good surface treatment to ensure that the bitumen stays.
Another possibility, and one which I will probably try out, is to layer the plastic wheel-well mouldings with Insuflex. This might actually work, as there is little in the form of noise absorptive materials in the wheel-well.
Will continue when I get round to doing the rest of the car...
The noise level in the car is significantly reduced. How much is hard to say since my ears have never been calibrated by Sirim, but let me describe the effect and we will venture a guess later...
a) Before soundproofing, the most distinct sound in the car was my muffler. This was because of the addition of a Y-pipe and the replacement of the stock centre silencer with a bullet. The sound was a low growl that used to fill the cabin.
b) After soundproofing the boot area, this exhaust sound was greatly reduced. I would venture that the level of this sound went down by at least 60% - 70%. At that time, and this was confirmed by Ong, that most of the noise now came from my floorboards, slightly in front of the front seats.
c) After this last bit of work, i.e. floorboards and front doors, the sound level in front has been greatly reduced and the most distinct sound(s) in the car are now split between the muffler and the front firewall. I used not to be able to hear my signal light relay clicking...now I hear it distinctly. Mostly, I can now hear my tyres.
Street noise is also greatly reduced. Passing motorbikes no longer rattle my rear view mirror. Passing cars hardly register.
When the car goes over bumps, it used to send a distinct "clunk" through the frame of the car. Now, the car appears smoother, less vibrations, and the "clunk" that usually follows going over imperfections in the road has been reduced to a "dub"...almost like a new car. A lot of irritating clicks and squeeks have also dissapeared. Overall the chasis feels firmer.
The overal level of vibrations going through the frame of the car, and felt by the driver through the steering, feet and behind are reduced by at least two-thirds.
Conclusion : I would estimate the noise reduction level is in the region of about 70%. Doubling the bitumen on the floorboards and firewall would probably have resulted in about a 5% better performance, so you will have to decide for yourself if this is economically viable.
Noise coming through the firewall is probably because I only layered about half-way up the firewall. In order to do the entire firewall, I would have had to take off the dash...which is not the kind of thing that a casual diy'er would want to do as it would probably take you 2 - 3 days to take it off and put it back on again. The solution I will probably try to take might be to improve the soundproofing of the bonnet, and maybe the upper firewall in the engine bay. I'm still considering the type of material to use for this.
I suspect the muffler sounds coming from the back will be improved by soundproofing the rear doors (which I left for another day), and the metal bulkhead separating the passenger compartment from the boot. There is also the possibility that the metal under the rear seat needs another layer of bitumen. This might be the next weekend's project.
The tyres, however, will be another problem entirely. Some people go so far as to dampen the entire mudguard (above the plastic wheel-well mouldings), but as this is an external part of the car, application of the bitumen has to be very proper with really good surface treatment to ensure that the bitumen stays.
Another possibility, and one which I will probably try out, is to layer the plastic wheel-well mouldings with Insuflex. This might actually work, as there is little in the form of noise absorptive materials in the wheel-well.
Will continue when I get round to doing the rest of the car...
Last edited:
wei...now even ppl horn u also no feel lor?
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