What causes engine vibration?

Danny

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Does anyone know what causes unnecessary engine vibrations? I've gotten all new mountings replaced but it still vibrates. Also the crossmember bushes and lower arm bushes have been replaced. During acceleration, the engine vibrates quite badly and I dare not drive above 3k rpm.

Now it's being checked at the workshop. My mech suspects it is a broken balancer shaft belt.

Feedbacks are much appreciated.
 

dolly

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balance the internals and get a balancer shaft removal kit lor. reduce lotsa rotating mass there
 

Itab

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i had tht kinda problem too last time,expecially on accelerating
it was due do my clutch slipping
replaced the worn clutch set,then ok dee
tht was for my case la :)
and also tht time my mountings all worn out dee
 

Danny

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whats a balancer shaft removal kit? Can the enging function without the balancer shaft?

I had all my mountings changed already as well as a new clutch plate, shoudn't be the clutch or the mounting. Also on last dyno there was no clutch slip.
 

Itab

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icic....wats a balancer shaft removal kit?me also donno leh,curious to know wat it is :)

plugs?timing?but unlikely la....these are very common and easy to spot on problems...well juz trying to supply some ideas,if i can think of any more probable cause,i'll post,hehe

keep us updated also la danny,wanna wat can cause such problems :)
 

vestax

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yes you can run the engine without a balance shaft , but then would you be able to stand the harsh vibrations ?. lots of people will remove it cause it will lowere the maintainance cost to buy the balance belt & bearing which is not cheap . but thats out of the point . best to balance the engine and then get the balance shaft removed and place the shaft eliminator kit . if you don't balance the engine , then u just have to get use to the vibrations , its just the matter of time .

itab ,
no need to worry , your 4G93 doesn't run on balance shaft , mostly 2.0 litre engines and above use the balance shaft to eleminate the vribrations .

yes clutch set does make the engine vibrates while on the move too , mainly cause flywheel surface is not level or clutch not align properly while installation or there is too much wear & tear which makes it not balanced .

danny ,
me & my friend is still curious with the mod you did , so hopefully you could reply us as soon as possible .
 

Itab

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oh ok...thanks sifu vestax
got any pictures of those balancer removal kit?or pic of balancer shaft?nv see b4 leh....kinda curious wat it is
 

vestax

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balance shaft eliminator kit



So why do it?

Simply put, reliability. The balance shafts are only there for your butt, not the engine. They are there to cancel out vibrations at idle and around 3-4K that would be annoying to the average driver that just owns a car for transportation, and wants the drive to be as smooth as possible. For the enthusiast, though, the slightly increased vibration from removing the shafts can easily be tolerated (right after doing this mod, you may think the vibration is much worse, but the vast majority of people barely notice it after a couple of days). The balance shaft system adds more complexity to the engine. Most importantly, if the front balance shaft belt breaks, it can tangle itself in the timing belt, leading to a trashed engine. Too many dealerships replace the timing belt and leave the old balance shaft belt in place if it looks OK. If you have a shop of any type replace your timing belt, MAKE THEM REPLACE THE BALANCE SHAFT BELT ALSO, no matter how new it is!. I know someone who had a balance shaft belt fail after roughly 30K miles, he got lucky and caught it before it tore up the timing belt and trashed his engine.

There is no reliability decrease from removing the shafts as long as the job is done properly. Reliability should actually increase, and the engine should rev slightly easier, as there is less reciprocating weight for the crank to accelerate/decelerate (roughly 5-7 lbs for both shafts). The only real drawback is that the engine will vibrate a bit more at idle and about 3-4K rpm (some people have reported it vibrating harder at 6K and up, but I haven't seen that on my 3 cars). You do NOT have to have your entire shortblock balanced to do this job. It will smooth out the engine a bit, but it isn't absolutely necessary. I balanced the engine on one of my cars, not the other 2, and they don't vibrate that much more than the balanced engine. However, if you are doing a complete rebuild on your engine, balancing it wouldn't hurt. 4G63s are usually very well balanced from the factory, so very little needs to be done to have them fully balanced.

Removing the balance shafts also makes future timing belt replacements a lot easier - I can replace a timing belt and all pulleys, etc, on my car in less than an hour (of course, I have removed the power steering and AC, that cuts down on the time a lot).

Parts Required:

Turbo drain tube gasket
Oilpump cover gasket
Oil filter bracket gasket
Balance Shaft Eliminator Parts (listed at top of VFAQ next to picture)
Timing belt and associated parts (if planning to do timing belt at the same time)
1 tube "Ultra Gray" RTV silicone
Oil and filter
2 or more cans of good brake parts cleaner
Tube of Loctite medium strength(blue) thread locker
Tube of Loctite high strength (red) thread locker

Bearing grease (or Vaseline, white grease, or moly lube)
It is recommended that you go ahead and replace the front crankshaft and oil pump seals while you have it apart if the car is high mileage

Print a copy of the timing belt VFAQ as this procedure requires removal and re-installation of the timing belt.

Raise front of car on jack stands. Remove driver's front wheel and inner splash shield. Follow timing belt procedure and remove all parts necessary to remove the timing belt BUT before removing the timing belt, crack the front balance shaft sprocket bolt loose (the belts help hold the sprocket still while breaking it loose). If you plan on installing a new oilpump seal, crack the oilpump sprocket nut loose now. The balance shaft sprocket is the small one circled in red, the oilpump sprocket is the large one.



Oil Pan Removal...

Drain oil
Disconnect turbo drain tube from the oilpan
AWD:
Remove the left cross member that runs front to back
Remove down pipe
Remove transfer case
Remove bolts that hold left axle carrier bearing to block
FWD:
remove the cross member that runs from front to back
Remove down pipe
Remove oil pan bolts
Pry oil pan loose with wide blade scraper or screwdriver and remove pan
Disconnect oil pump pick-up tube (tube with screen on end) and set aside
The rear balance shaft bearing is circled in red.



Kit installation...
This step assumes you have the timing belt off. Remove front balance shaft "B" belt, balance belt tensioner, and sprocket from the balance shaft (the sprocket is still in place in this picture). The hole for the balance belt tensioner is circled. When reinstalling the oilpump cover, make sure to either get a new shorter bolt, or install the old pulley and bolt. Put some RTV on the bolt threads before tightening it down. If you do not seal this hole, you will have a massive oil leak.



Unbolt the oil filter block assembly from the engine. NOTE which bolts go where, there are 3 different lengths. If you lose track if which bolt goes where, don't panic. Just put the bolts into the holes of the oil filter block, and move them around until they all stick out an equal amount past the back of the oil filter block - when you have all 4 bolts in the right holes, they will all protrude almost exactly the same amount from the back. The bolt holes are circled.



Unbolt the oilpump cover from the engine (make sure to get all of the bolts!). Pry the cover loose from the engine block. The screwdriver shows a good spot to pry on to break the cover loose from the engine block.



Here is another good spot to pry on to break the cover loose from the engine block



Once the cover is loose, loosely bolt the balance shaft sprocket back onto the front balance shaft, and pry out on it to pull it loose from its' bearings. Then remove the sprocket. Then prepare to pull the cover and shafts.



The engine must be dropped down to get the front balance shaft to clear the frame when you pull it from the engine. Place a floor jack under the front crossmember that runs along the front of the car. If possible, strap the jack to the crossmember with wire or duct tape, as the crossmember will shift and rotate once it is dropped from the frame. Remove the nuts at each end of the crossmember and lower it a little to pull the oilpump cover and rear balance shaft off of the engine (The rear balance shaft will come out with the cover). Lower the engine further until you can pull the front balance shaft out of the engine and clear the frame.



Here is the oilpump cover out of the car. The red circled areas are the front crankshaft and oil pump seals you should replace on a high mileage engine. When replacing the seals, it is a good idea to put a thin layer of RTV in the oilpump cover seal mounting flanges, then install the seals, then wipe off any excess RTV. I have had a couple of crankshaft seals leak around the edges after carefully installing a new one when not using RTV.

The pink circled area is the bolt hole for the balance shaft tensioner pulley. When reinstalling the cover, make sure to either get a new shorter bolt, or install the old pulley and bolt. Put some RTV on the bolt threads before tightening it down. If you do not seal this hole, you will have a massive oil leak.



Clean the oilpump cover well, then pull the front balance shaft seal shown here. Just slip a flatblade screwdriver under the inside edge and pry it out.



Here is the cover with the front balance shaft seal removed.



Kit version - Mix up some JB Weld, and press/pound the freezeplug included with the kit into the balance shaft seal seat. The raised rim around the seat may crack when pressing the plug in, if it does, just add more JB Weld to the crack (it shouldn't crack to the point it causes a leak or anything, it's just annoying). You can also file the edge of the plug down a tiny bit to avoid cracking the lip, but use the JBWeld.



Here is a rear view of the oilpump cover, with rear balance shaft still installed, for reference



Unbolt the oilpump rear cover from the front cover. The small gear goes on the short shaft included in the kit, the large gear stays in the front cover.



A view of the rear balance shaft and rear oilpump cover, with the balance shaft bolt loosened. You will most likely have to grab the balance shaft with vicegrips to hold it while cracking the bolt loose.



A view of the rear balance shaft an rear oilpump cover, with the pump gear off. Note that the end of the balance shaft looks a lot like the short shaft included in the kit.



Bolt the short shaft included in the kit to the oilpump gear you just removed. NOTE the direction in which the gear goes on the shaft! The bolt fits inside the step in the gear. Apply high strength Loctite(red) to the bolt threads, install the bolt, and torque to 29 ft-lb.



This is why the step in the gear is on the bolt side - it fits around the seal/plug shown here (next to the large oilpump gear).



Here is the short shaft and small gear inserted back in the rear oilpump cover, from the back side.



Here is the short shaft and small gear inserted back in the front oilpump cover, from the back side. Pack the gears and space in the rear cover with grease (this will prime the oilpump at startup - You can also use Vaseline, white grease, or moly lube. You basically want something thick enough to stay put until you turn the engine over for the first time to prime the pump.). Oil up the short shaft with a touch of clean motor oil and slide the rear oilpump cover onto the front cover. Clean the thread holes and pump cover bolts with brake clean, apply some medium strength Loctite (blue) to the bolt threads and torque them to 12 ft-lbs.



Here is a view of the engine. The rear balance shaft bearing is shown circled here. This bearing can be left alone. The front shaft bearings, however, need to be removed and replaced with the blockoff bearings included in the kit. These blockoff bearings are necessary because the stock bearings have oiling holes for the balance shaft, and if you don't block them off, you will lose oil pressure.



Here is a view of the engine from the inside, showing the oilpump cover reinstalled, with the new short oilpump shaft sticking out of the rear oilpump cover.



Here is a view of the engine block, showing the front balance shaft bearing.



ere is a view of the engine block, showing the rear balance shaft bearing as seen through the front bearing (with the engine in the car, you won't get this view, you'll see it from the bottom of the block next to the crank). The oiling hole in the front stock bearing is circled



Here is a closeup of the front balance shaft bearing. The water pump would be in the upper right of the pic if it were installed. Note the screw in plug on the left (circled) - that is to allow the factory to drill the oilfeed hole from the bearing journal into the oil galley.



Here's a pic of the timing belt installed on the engine, after the balance shaft kit is installed. Note in this pic that the factory rubber-coated plug is used for the front balance shaft hole in the oilpump cover.



SOURCE FROM VFAQ
 

MitonCT26

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Cover the holes nicely with silicone, but dont overdo it....i kena ooo...lucky the timing belt never kena oil... :P

there are some urban legend saying that removing the balance shafts will increase up to 15hp...betul ke?

i know only one thing...damn responsive already the engine...and it reduces the extra load covered by the oil pump... ;)
 

Danny

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thanks for the info vestax... eh I replied your pm a few times already la.. why still never get?
 

Danny

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update - after checking the car for a few days it seems it might be due to the balancer shaft bearing being worn out.

Is it worthwhile fixing it, if thats the problem... or would cost the same to just remove the balancer shaft with the removal kit?

How much does the removal kit cost?
 

dolly

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danny, get ur internals balanced first lar since ur car is sick anyway,

hp should increase, cause there is less parasitic drag inform of rotational mass... if i'm not mistaken its like 5lbs?

should also remove the balancer shaft if you plan to rev high high ^^; if the belt slips its gonna be very costly
 

DJ-EVO3

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Vestax.... what do u do for ur living? huh?

I just wonder.... why don u open a work shop?
 

vestax

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ermm i thought i stated the source was from vfaq.com ? didn't i . all this stuff can get from the net one , 4G63 is one of the famous engines in the States , cause they have it on their galants and eclipse , so basically being a mat salleh , sure they want to diy here & there cause they have the tools in their garage , when they diy , they`ll write about it on the net , so basically vfaq.com is a bible for 4G63 1gen or 2nd gen . there is where i got lots of info from and not to mention other sites too . so when i`ve experience something which i had done on my own , i`ll try to contribute to the community too .

if you really one to know something , please do a search on the net alright , i bet there is plenty of info out there . the problem with some people , they are too lazy to do a search , and when some one explain they don't take note , and they keep on asking the same thing again & again and act smart :lol: . " malaysian mentality "
 

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