Super-Charge
- Thread starter razaksa
- Start date
go to Turbo Sang maa!! he is a specialist in either turbocharge or supercharge cars. look for drager racing development workshop.
i ve alled turbo sang b4..they have not developed any kits yet for the gen2...anyone know other sc specialist esp in JB area
ijnek
basically u can supercharge any car provided you can customize piping, sc with mounting alligned with pulleys, intercooler and aftermarket ECU that can manage AF, ignition timing and boost. I heard Turbo Sang from Kepong KL SC'd a Satria GTI. If you looking for low to mid end torque then SC is the way to go. Dont boost more than 0.5bar otherwise youll blow ur engine. Expected improvement;
7.2464PSI(0.5bar) divide by 14.7 PSI(ATm Pressure) times 100 = 49% improvement on Torque and HP assuming perfect SC system without losses which is quite unrealistic. More real life improvement would be around 35% increase in performance after frictional, transmission and mechanical losses.
If you wana go above 0.5bar then forged pistons and forged, conrods and crankshafts, heavy duty clutch plates, power diff would be advisable with upgraded brakes off course more power = more $$$ fly away....
GTI SUPERCHARGER BOLT - ON KIT REVIEW
Dear guys and fellow members of ZTH….
Happy New Year to all…….I’m about to give you guys at ZTH forums a detail review on the GTI installed with our bolt-on supercharger kit and what's coming in the near future. So please bear with me and thanks in advance for reading. All feed backs or enquiries are most welcome and I will try my best to answer all your questions in relation to supercharger and it’s kit which is available very, very, very soon to the Malaysian market – especially for proton models….Here it goes……
As mentioned before by some forum members of ZTH earlier , there was once a GTI fitted with a supercharger bolt-on kit featured in Hypertune. That was our project car that we undertook 4 years ago. In fact, this GTI was featured in other magazines and publication like KERETA, NST’s Cars, Bikes & Trucks, Asian Auto besides Hypertune …. :D
How it all started….If any of you guys could remember, there was once a Kembara featured in Hypertune on it’s hybrid modifications plus upgraded with lots of goodies to boost at 1 bar??? This very same car was the front cover print of KERETA magazine…I have been using this kembara supercharged for over 4 years and I fell in love with the supercharger as it gave me the right torque & power band which suited the car and my driving style – Imagine, a daily driven car with loads of low end torque to play around with minimal gear shifts…I figured, why not develop & transfer the same sort of torque and hp gains using this concept to other makes, like the proton models?. That makes sense as most of us will benefit from it as most of us use our cars as a daily driver…How many bolt on kits in the market today that could deliver instant power & torque from as low as 1000rpm in third gear without any judders or protest from the engine????. Superchargers could> :D
Agreed by my sifu, Turbo Sang who is actually the main brain behind the Kembara & the 1st GTI supercharged bolt-on kit in Malaysia. He has lots of knowledge and experience in this field of car modifications. We began developing kits for new Proton models and further enhancing the GTI with a 2nd stage kit that will boost torque & hp even further, still utilising the original engine. You will get to see this 2nd stage GTI with its dyno figures, real soon in the comings months of car magazines…..As for stage 1, the GTI kit registered 162.3hp on wheel and max torque for 200 nm at 2800rpm….All these figures were dyno proven using the GTI 4G93P block & head, stock clutch, gearbox with only 30% fabrication of certain parts for the SC unit and other stuffs..
Unlike an engine transplant, we most likely will encounter these problems:
1) Competency of mechanics, both in workmanship & wiring.
2) Responsibility of mechanics.
3) Condition of half cut, need lots of luck in choosing a good reliable one.
Japs are not fond of taking care of engines
4) Minimum 1week time frame for engine transplant.
5) Another 1week to trouble shoot problems
6) Puspakom & JPJ inspection, documentation
7) Countless stops at JPJ & police roadblocks due to overwhelming sign
of front mount intercooler.
8) Minimum RM10k involved. (4G93T half cut – RM5,500)
9) Inspection for engine transplant will be very stringent in the near future
10) Higher maintenance required for turbo applications cos they get their
lubrication from engine oil, any leaks or problem related to turbo fins or
turbo, you lose engine oil pressure with lots of white smoke.
Note: If you have chosen your car to perform like a weekend monster with
drag racing in mind, then turbo chargers is the way to go.
Our Supercharger Bolt – On Kit
1) Engine well taken care by you, (the owner)
2) Require 1 to 2 days installation time frame.
3) Perhaps another 1 day for trouble shooting, (Just maybe.)
4) Strictly bolt on application, just like your air filter or exhaust.
5) Very low profile, no intercoolers or BOV sound
6) Only tell tale is perhaps exhaust, SC do sound slightly louder than turbo
7) Only RM5,500 + installation (GTI 1.8). Other models much cheaper
8) 162.3hp on wheel & 200nm of torque at 2800rpm – (Dynoed)
9) All stock components, clutch, gearbox, cams.
10) Boosting at 0.7bar
11) Very low maintenance, as SC unit has it’s own reservoir for lubrication.
Oil change for SC unit is once a year (Recommended). Mine lasted 3
years. Worst scenario imaginable, is when the SC belt snap or the SC
unit jams, you just drive normal (NA Power) without boost, no white
smoke or fear of loosing oil pressure. Besides that you just do the
normal servicing.
Note : If you have decided that you want a low maintenance, pocket rocket
with loads of low end torque, minimal gear shifts as a daily driver with
respectable power, then superchargers is your game.
Durability, Fuel Consumption & Long Distance Driving.
We joint the GTI club to Phuket in 2003, travel in total 2400km B) without any problems at all :D , not even minor ones. Fuel check at every stop, our GTI with the SC kit was on par with the slightly modded GTI’s but we were slightly higher in consumption compared to the strictly NA….Average travelling speed 140km – 190km, with lots of hard revving at traffic lights trying to catch up with main convoy. Took us 4 days to & fro, driving from 9am – 8pm. Only stops for fuel, food and the loo……In fact, prior to Phuket trip with the club, this GTI kit was doing on ‘road test’ for more than 2 years. ;)
New Proton Models
Do keep a very close look out as we are in the final stages of launching the supercharger bolt-on kit for 1.5 & 1.6 EFI Wira, which will be very affordable and great value for money, can't reveal the price just yet, so hang in there :P . This kit comes with tip top goodies that u guys will appreciate at much lower prices with a lower profile compared to the 1st generation GTI kit. We will have dyno figures to show and not just hear say. Also, keep a look out for the GTI generation 2 Kit (Stage 2).
Important Statement & Clarification
Guys, I am not undermining turbo applications in any way, be it bolt on or engine transplants, neither am I trying to claim my SC kit is the best in town, I just felt that due to the lack of knowledge for many Malaysians pertaining to superchargers and it’s kit. I’m very worried that many end users will get the wrong information, perception + It’s sad to hear people saying or passing negative remarks on our kit (cost factor) simply because they do not understand our SC kits where endless hours of research & development work…has gone into testing our SC kits.
By just installing a SC in a car that holds no dyno figures or has no durability record (Long Drives or past records), fuel consumption test, durability test (fatigue material wear) and claims to sell at a lower margins than us is not fair a statement at all. Most importantly, the SC kit claimed by others to sell cheaper than ours (RM5500 + installation) is a way much smaller unit and it's for 1.3 Wira. Our RM5500 kit is for the 4G93P 1.8. It’s like comparing apples to oranges…Funny thing is, people actually believe these hear says….
:(
Anyway, hang in there guys, you will soon see the difference in performance and value for money when we launch the 1.5 & 1.6 SC bolt on kit. Turbo Sang and I will let you all ZTH members be judges…. How about that.. :rolleyes:
So, to all ZTH members out there, please have a very clear open mind on what you read and claims or hear say, ask more questions as many factors are involve in developing & producing a bolt on kit. Just by installing a SC in the engine bay and hope for the best is definitely against our company policy. The engine or parts related in our kits must hold up to the boost and additional pressure it carries......
If it is that simple why no one has done something like these in the past for Mitsubishi engines???(at least not in Malaysia). AND why overseas tuners is charging an arm or a leg for their kits???..Because they invested loads of time and money into development work to test these kits and market them. New items, some may say, but remember it is you that is paying and are you willing to do so..?? We have proven that "Malaysia Boleh" by obtaining respectable results with the GTI SC kit at a very much lower price compare to overseas tuners. Hope you guys agree.... ;)
No doubt our sc unit is re-condition but do believe me when I say they “LAST”. and is up the job…it is also one way to develope kits that is affordable to most of us...AGREED :rolleyes: BTW there wasn't any bench mark for us to follow thus everything started from scratch basic for mitsubishi engines. We believe were the first tuners (in Malaysia) to have successfully place all running parts together to achieve the above mentioned results. Our objective is to provide end users with more options for power upgrading & torque at the lowest value…..possible... :D
Guess, everything bores down to what you guys wants out of you car, a daily driver with respectable power or a weekend beast….
We, (including myself) have to appreciate what people like Turbo Sang has done, imagine the endless hours spend in R & D, cracking heads to fabricate parts and if these parts fails then it’s back to the drawing board again, damn frust :( . His ‘know how’ techniques, knowledge and experience with engines is way beyond me. I just help in development work, test them, provide feedback to him for rectifications & improvements & market these kits (He’s also my partner in crime, hahaha :D ) I’m just an end user like you guys who wants power + the best value for money...too... :D
Since I’ve broken silence today for the first time in ZTH forum, please feel free to drop a line or two or PM me for test drives sessions, teh tarik or just make new friends, which is something I love to do, besides the boring R & D, testing works ... :lol:
Have fun guys and many thanks again for your time.
Regards
Gerard Kiong
Dear guys and fellow members of ZTH….
Happy New Year to all…….I’m about to give you guys at ZTH forums a detail review on the GTI installed with our bolt-on supercharger kit and what's coming in the near future. So please bear with me and thanks in advance for reading. All feed backs or enquiries are most welcome and I will try my best to answer all your questions in relation to supercharger and it’s kit which is available very, very, very soon to the Malaysian market – especially for proton models….Here it goes……
As mentioned before by some forum members of ZTH earlier , there was once a GTI fitted with a supercharger bolt-on kit featured in Hypertune. That was our project car that we undertook 4 years ago. In fact, this GTI was featured in other magazines and publication like KERETA, NST’s Cars, Bikes & Trucks, Asian Auto besides Hypertune …. :D
How it all started….If any of you guys could remember, there was once a Kembara featured in Hypertune on it’s hybrid modifications plus upgraded with lots of goodies to boost at 1 bar??? This very same car was the front cover print of KERETA magazine…I have been using this kembara supercharged for over 4 years and I fell in love with the supercharger as it gave me the right torque & power band which suited the car and my driving style – Imagine, a daily driven car with loads of low end torque to play around with minimal gear shifts…I figured, why not develop & transfer the same sort of torque and hp gains using this concept to other makes, like the proton models?. That makes sense as most of us will benefit from it as most of us use our cars as a daily driver…How many bolt on kits in the market today that could deliver instant power & torque from as low as 1000rpm in third gear without any judders or protest from the engine????. Superchargers could> :D
Agreed by my sifu, Turbo Sang who is actually the main brain behind the Kembara & the 1st GTI supercharged bolt-on kit in Malaysia. He has lots of knowledge and experience in this field of car modifications. We began developing kits for new Proton models and further enhancing the GTI with a 2nd stage kit that will boost torque & hp even further, still utilising the original engine. You will get to see this 2nd stage GTI with its dyno figures, real soon in the comings months of car magazines…..As for stage 1, the GTI kit registered 162.3hp on wheel and max torque for 200 nm at 2800rpm….All these figures were dyno proven using the GTI 4G93P block & head, stock clutch, gearbox with only 30% fabrication of certain parts for the SC unit and other stuffs..
Unlike an engine transplant, we most likely will encounter these problems:
1) Competency of mechanics, both in workmanship & wiring.
2) Responsibility of mechanics.
3) Condition of half cut, need lots of luck in choosing a good reliable one.
Japs are not fond of taking care of engines
4) Minimum 1week time frame for engine transplant.
5) Another 1week to trouble shoot problems
6) Puspakom & JPJ inspection, documentation
7) Countless stops at JPJ & police roadblocks due to overwhelming sign
of front mount intercooler.
8) Minimum RM10k involved. (4G93T half cut – RM5,500)
9) Inspection for engine transplant will be very stringent in the near future
10) Higher maintenance required for turbo applications cos they get their
lubrication from engine oil, any leaks or problem related to turbo fins or
turbo, you lose engine oil pressure with lots of white smoke.
Note: If you have chosen your car to perform like a weekend monster with
drag racing in mind, then turbo chargers is the way to go.
Our Supercharger Bolt – On Kit
1) Engine well taken care by you, (the owner)
2) Require 1 to 2 days installation time frame.
3) Perhaps another 1 day for trouble shooting, (Just maybe.)
4) Strictly bolt on application, just like your air filter or exhaust.
5) Very low profile, no intercoolers or BOV sound
6) Only tell tale is perhaps exhaust, SC do sound slightly louder than turbo
7) Only RM5,500 + installation (GTI 1.8). Other models much cheaper
8) 162.3hp on wheel & 200nm of torque at 2800rpm – (Dynoed)
9) All stock components, clutch, gearbox, cams.
10) Boosting at 0.7bar
11) Very low maintenance, as SC unit has it’s own reservoir for lubrication.
Oil change for SC unit is once a year (Recommended). Mine lasted 3
years. Worst scenario imaginable, is when the SC belt snap or the SC
unit jams, you just drive normal (NA Power) without boost, no white
smoke or fear of loosing oil pressure. Besides that you just do the
normal servicing.
Note : If you have decided that you want a low maintenance, pocket rocket
with loads of low end torque, minimal gear shifts as a daily driver with
respectable power, then superchargers is your game.
Durability, Fuel Consumption & Long Distance Driving.
We joint the GTI club to Phuket in 2003, travel in total 2400km B) without any problems at all :D , not even minor ones. Fuel check at every stop, our GTI with the SC kit was on par with the slightly modded GTI’s but we were slightly higher in consumption compared to the strictly NA….Average travelling speed 140km – 190km, with lots of hard revving at traffic lights trying to catch up with main convoy. Took us 4 days to & fro, driving from 9am – 8pm. Only stops for fuel, food and the loo……In fact, prior to Phuket trip with the club, this GTI kit was doing on ‘road test’ for more than 2 years. ;)
New Proton Models
Do keep a very close look out as we are in the final stages of launching the supercharger bolt-on kit for 1.5 & 1.6 EFI Wira, which will be very affordable and great value for money, can't reveal the price just yet, so hang in there :P . This kit comes with tip top goodies that u guys will appreciate at much lower prices with a lower profile compared to the 1st generation GTI kit. We will have dyno figures to show and not just hear say. Also, keep a look out for the GTI generation 2 Kit (Stage 2).
Important Statement & Clarification
Guys, I am not undermining turbo applications in any way, be it bolt on or engine transplants, neither am I trying to claim my SC kit is the best in town, I just felt that due to the lack of knowledge for many Malaysians pertaining to superchargers and it’s kit. I’m very worried that many end users will get the wrong information, perception + It’s sad to hear people saying or passing negative remarks on our kit (cost factor) simply because they do not understand our SC kits where endless hours of research & development work…has gone into testing our SC kits.
By just installing a SC in a car that holds no dyno figures or has no durability record (Long Drives or past records), fuel consumption test, durability test (fatigue material wear) and claims to sell at a lower margins than us is not fair a statement at all. Most importantly, the SC kit claimed by others to sell cheaper than ours (RM5500 + installation) is a way much smaller unit and it's for 1.3 Wira. Our RM5500 kit is for the 4G93P 1.8. It’s like comparing apples to oranges…Funny thing is, people actually believe these hear says….
:( Anyway, hang in there guys, you will soon see the difference in performance and value for money when we launch the 1.5 & 1.6 SC bolt on kit. Turbo Sang and I will let you all ZTH members be judges…. How about that.. :rolleyes:
So, to all ZTH members out there, please have a very clear open mind on what you read and claims or hear say, ask more questions as many factors are involve in developing & producing a bolt on kit. Just by installing a SC in the engine bay and hope for the best is definitely against our company policy. The engine or parts related in our kits must hold up to the boost and additional pressure it carries......
If it is that simple why no one has done something like these in the past for Mitsubishi engines???(at least not in Malaysia). AND why overseas tuners is charging an arm or a leg for their kits???..Because they invested loads of time and money into development work to test these kits and market them. New items, some may say, but remember it is you that is paying and are you willing to do so..?? We have proven that "Malaysia Boleh" by obtaining respectable results with the GTI SC kit at a very much lower price compare to overseas tuners. Hope you guys agree.... ;)
No doubt our sc unit is re-condition but do believe me when I say they “LAST”. and is up the job…it is also one way to develope kits that is affordable to most of us...AGREED :rolleyes: BTW there wasn't any bench mark for us to follow thus everything started from scratch basic for mitsubishi engines. We believe were the first tuners (in Malaysia) to have successfully place all running parts together to achieve the above mentioned results. Our objective is to provide end users with more options for power upgrading & torque at the lowest value…..possible... :D
Guess, everything bores down to what you guys wants out of you car, a daily driver with respectable power or a weekend beast….
We, (including myself) have to appreciate what people like Turbo Sang has done, imagine the endless hours spend in R & D, cracking heads to fabricate parts and if these parts fails then it’s back to the drawing board again, damn frust :( . His ‘know how’ techniques, knowledge and experience with engines is way beyond me. I just help in development work, test them, provide feedback to him for rectifications & improvements & market these kits (He’s also my partner in crime, hahaha :D ) I’m just an end user like you guys who wants power + the best value for money...too... :D
Since I’ve broken silence today for the first time in ZTH forum, please feel free to drop a line or two or PM me for test drives sessions, teh tarik or just make new friends, which is something I love to do, besides the boring R & D, testing works ... :lol:
Have fun guys and many thanks again for your time.
Regards
Gerard Kiong
Hello.
Thanks fhe write up.
My questions are based on Stock NA to mild SC conversions
Actually, I would like to ask if you could detail;
How is the electronics dealt with?
Can you run with the stock ECU alone?
Or do we have to add a piggy back as a minimum to cope?
Also, do you recommend any piggy backs with your SC conversions?
On the mechanical part of it,
Do you fabricate the pulleys yourselves?
The SC units itself, new or used reconditioned units?
Also, where is Turbo Sang? :blink: Sorry for the questions.
Thanks fhe write up.
My questions are based on Stock NA to mild SC conversions
Actually, I would like to ask if you could detail;
How is the electronics dealt with?
Can you run with the stock ECU alone?
Or do we have to add a piggy back as a minimum to cope?
Also, do you recommend any piggy backs with your SC conversions?
On the mechanical part of it,
Do you fabricate the pulleys yourselves?
The SC units itself, new or used reconditioned units?
Also, where is Turbo Sang? :blink: Sorry for the questions.
more questions here...
1. wat are the parts involved?...
2. do u guys customize supercharger kit for vios (since its a toyota)?
3. how much would it roughly cost?..
4. how would the wear and tear be? as high as turbo charging...??
1. wat are the parts involved?...
2. do u guys customize supercharger kit for vios (since its a toyota)?
3. how much would it roughly cost?..
4. how would the wear and tear be? as high as turbo charging...??
Hi guys,
With regards to the supercharger bolt on kits and advantages of superchargers, you could refer to a post which I've submitted in the ZTH under, car modifications section...I do agree to a certain degree that you can't boost high with bolt on kits, be it turbo applications or supercharged applications BUT my golden rule of thumb is if you get the fuel curve, fuel mapping & timing right with no detonation you could run higher boost which I've proven with my GTI 1.8 (4G93P) with a bolt on kit and at stage one with stock clutch, pistons, no metal gasket, or forged pistons, basically NA engine and gearbox with a boost of 0.7 bar.
Just with the help of fuel mapping, extractor, full exhaust system and after market air filters. It registered 162.3hp on wheel and max torque at 200nm @ 2800rpm....Been running stage one with no problems for 3 years now and even did a long trip to PHUKET (2400km) with the GTI club last year.......2003
As for our stage 2 kit, still using the same stuffs, maybe mod a bit here and there I'm running 1bar of boost now (1 year)...Sorry guys, can't reveal any further information or details on stage two yet as it is still not ready to hit the market yet..
As for your question on Gen2, Turbo Sang did discuss with me on the possiblities to develope a supercharger bolt-on kit for the Gen2 model, unfortunately, to me it is still a fresh new engine (not proven yet, unlike mitsubishi) and we would require a bit of time to understand its fuelling system, electrical (EMS), gearbox system before we begin R & D works. Oh! . the other problem is that we do not have a test car yet to do and R & D work. Hahaha :D
Do keep me posted, should you manage to get an installer to install a supercharger unit in your Gen2....Just beware, you must get a competent installer else your nightmare has just begun...
Do contact us once in a while to check on our progress. ..who knows, a Gen2 may be in the making. :rolleyes:
I could be contacted at 012-3073928, 012-3872153
Many fine regards and happy new year :D
Gerard
With regards to the supercharger bolt on kits and advantages of superchargers, you could refer to a post which I've submitted in the ZTH under, car modifications section...I do agree to a certain degree that you can't boost high with bolt on kits, be it turbo applications or supercharged applications BUT my golden rule of thumb is if you get the fuel curve, fuel mapping & timing right with no detonation you could run higher boost which I've proven with my GTI 1.8 (4G93P) with a bolt on kit and at stage one with stock clutch, pistons, no metal gasket, or forged pistons, basically NA engine and gearbox with a boost of 0.7 bar.
Just with the help of fuel mapping, extractor, full exhaust system and after market air filters. It registered 162.3hp on wheel and max torque at 200nm @ 2800rpm....Been running stage one with no problems for 3 years now and even did a long trip to PHUKET (2400km) with the GTI club last year.......2003
As for our stage 2 kit, still using the same stuffs, maybe mod a bit here and there I'm running 1bar of boost now (1 year)...Sorry guys, can't reveal any further information or details on stage two yet as it is still not ready to hit the market yet..
As for your question on Gen2, Turbo Sang did discuss with me on the possiblities to develope a supercharger bolt-on kit for the Gen2 model, unfortunately, to me it is still a fresh new engine (not proven yet, unlike mitsubishi) and we would require a bit of time to understand its fuelling system, electrical (EMS), gearbox system before we begin R & D works. Oh! . the other problem is that we do not have a test car yet to do and R & D work. Hahaha :D
Do keep me posted, should you manage to get an installer to install a supercharger unit in your Gen2....Just beware, you must get a competent installer else your nightmare has just begun...
Do contact us once in a while to check on our progress. ..who knows, a Gen2 may be in the making. :rolleyes:
I could be contacted at 012-3073928, 012-3872153
Many fine regards and happy new year :D
Gerard
aiyo acbc why wanna supercharge it la , might as well turbocharge it . if not transplant this into your galant la . :lol:
Mitsubishi also got supercharge mah .
Mitsubishi also got supercharge mah .
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