Difference between L2 and L5?

[blades]

..."go 3cyl if want to sprint, go 4cyl if want comfort"

Hahaa, I'll have to keep that in mind! The shop that will be installing the motor has warned us to stay away from Turbos since the Thai Miras never came with Turbos. Parts need to be imported so they are expensive as well as difficult and slow to find. I will ask the huge engine shop that we are getting it from if they stock all the parts though. They do have a lot of stuff!

If I go for non-Turbo, what is the best 3 cylinder to go for? I was leaning for the JB-EL since its the only one I can see that puts out 43kW but it is a 4cylinder.

 

[papagoines]

Hahaa, I'll have to keep that in mind! The shop that will be installing the motor has warned us to stay away from Turbos since the Thai Miras never came with Turbos. Parts need to be imported so they are expensive as well as difficult and slow to find. I will ask the huge engine shop that we are getting it from if they stock all the parts though. They do have a lot of stuff!

If I go for non-Turbo, what is the best 3 cylinder to go for? I was leaning for the JB-EL since its the only one I can see that puts out 43kW but it is a 4cylinder.

yup.. it's the most powerful (on paper) NA motor from daihatsu...

why don't you go 850cc/1000cc?

 

[blades]

First, I am not sure if those motors are even available here although I could easily find out.

Second, I don't imagine they would be an easy install. I doubt the motor mounts would like up, would they? If so, I'd love to get the CB70 Charade engine! But then again, I'd probably need to upgrade everything else on the car too if I did that.

 

[mag9556]

Folks....

me had change engine again from EF to JB...

now got 1 problem... engine ramp till 10k also wont cut.... anything to make it cut ar..?

 

[papagoines]

Oops! sorry.. forgot that you came from thai... 850cc are abundant here in Malaysia for Perodua Kancil, essentially a rebadge Mira L2

Not sure about Mira L70 chassis but Mira L2 can accept 1000cc motor from daihatsu storia or Mira L7 Gino but just the engine, not the gearbox...

First, I am not sure if those motors are even available here although I could easily find out.

Second, I don't imagine they would be an easy install. I doubt the motor mounts would like up, would they? If so, I'd love to get the CB70 Charade engine! But then again, I'd probably need to upgrade everything else on the car too if I did that.

Err... you could open a new thread bro... me dun know why your engien won't cut...

Folks....

me had change engine again from EF to JB...

now got 1 problem... engine ramp till 10k also wont cut.... anything to make it cut ar..?

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

Nowadays, L5 users are catching up fast due to parts getting easier to get these days.... now its a matter of preference...

L2 Pros and Cons

1. Pro - Parts exchangeability wif kancil and some kelisa
2. Pro - Since L2 arrived earlier, most performance tuners already understands L2 design and limitation more
3. Pro - Easy upgrade from 660cc to 850cc/1000cc simply by changing block from kancil/kelisa/kenari
4. Pro - Less headache when swapping since its a direct bolt on
5. Cons - its an ageing design. It last stop production 1993
6. Cons - Prone to overheat on long distance hi speed cruising
7. Cons - Suffers same air con issues as kancil even after swapping with L5 dashboard and blowers

L5 Pros and Cons

1. Pro - for the 16v models, its smoother than L2
2. Pro - Capable highway cruiser... so far no overheat
3. Pro - It uses timing chain, so no more timing belt issues
4. Pro - The aircon are colder and more reliable
5. Pro - Newer design than L2, so more likely to see untouched (i.e. not overhauled yet) unit at hafkat
6. Cons - Parts are not easy to come by, but they are increasing in numbers..
7. Cons - Tuning capabilities are still limited since tuners still learning its design and systems
8. Cons - Not so easy to swap if you don't have the original subframe...

I hope that L2 users correct me if I'm wrong...

IMHO, L2 are best for performance junkies... L5 for ppl who want to take it easy... but stock vs stock both are the same....

but then, at drag strips, autocross in japan all uses L5 engines right so its a matter of time L5 will replace L2 as a performance option

for me.... I'm a recent convert to L5 16v turbo

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e346/papagoines/My%20Car/EngineSwap/Engine/IMG_1961-resized.jpg

...and loving it :proud:

Wow...Only 3 pages of discussion already so interesting. Learn lots from your reply. I just got one recently. Looking forward to L5s conversion as well. Since I saw your reply you recently converted to L5.

But is it plug and play for any kancil? Looking at L5s (EF-RL) (AT). Just want a comfortable ride with good pick up and power. Tired of getting tailed behind by bigger cars thinking im going slow when the stock 660cc is just that much it can perform. :frown:

Still trying to get it back to its good condition right now. This is a good thread. Hope it will continue with more Kancil/Mira owners.

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

Seems there is a newer one in the block. JBDET that is plug n play. An improve version of JBJL. Thought JBJL turbo was good enough.
But seems JBDET is better

 

[4gbanger]

bro, JB-DET and JB-JL has slight different in bore & stroke.. the CC n hp are the same.. but torque curve are different.. one thing i know, JB-DET is kinda poor at low-end torque but high-end is good. i guess JB-JL is vice versa. with the correct combination of this two engine might increase overall CC and HP. I'm on my recent project to transplant turbo engine in my recently bought kancil. pls share any info..

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

bro, JB-DET and JB-JL has slight different in bore & stroke.. the CC n hp are the same.. but torque curve are different.. one thing i know, JB-DET is kinda poor at low-end torque but high-end is good. i guess JB-JL is vice versa. with the correct combination of this two engine might increase overall CC and HP. I'm on my recent project to transplant turbo engine in my recently bought kancil. pls share any info..

High five bro. How long have you bought it? Seems we have same thing in mind. A small project but interesting and worthwhile to me.

I'm looking at either JBJL or just settle with EF-RL. Just want to improve the pick up. Enough power to pulling power. Just got it for a week and already have bigger cars bullying my baby. Especially wiras tailing me Seems JBJL and EF-RL is almost same price. JBJL is newer

JBDET wise, a guy said is a good engine but then sad thing is that it has lack of R&D. His is manual 5 speed with emanage. Can rev up to 7krpm

I'm still doing research around. For me, if that's the case, I would go for JBJL. I wan't more torque. Not sure can mix and match parts from JBDET to improve it further?

Yes bro, hope more Mira and Kancil owners are coming back to this thread. Let's keep it alive. :top:

 

[4gbanger]

actually, i have previous kancil which is raced on SNF. but sadly the car burned after race due to rear battery spark. now i bought newer 2003 kancil and facing the same problem as yours which is stock satria/wira tailgating as they were to race with my car.. i'm planning to take my old L2s engine to transplant. that engine's internal were change to stock before it was on fire. even the aircon works well. but i'm planning to go for better aftermarket camshaft for better torque n hp. but not that extreme since i drove this mouse to work.

anymore info will share here.. all the best for your project JB-JL.

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

actually, i have previous kancil which is raced on SNF. but sadly the car burned after race due to rear battery spark. now i bought newer 2003 kancil and facing the same problem as yours which is stock satria/wira tailgating as they were to race with my car.. i'm planning to take my old L2s engine to transplant. that engine's internal were change to stock before it was on fire. even the aircon works well. but i'm planning to go for better aftermarket camshaft for better torque n hp. but not that extreme since i drove this mouse to work.

anymore info will share here.. all the best for your project JB-JL.

Wow...that's sad case man. Glad you are alright. 2003 model. Means yours should cost more than mine.

All the best to you too bro. Same here, now currently using this Deer from point A & B only.
Yours 660cc A/T too? That's why don't intend to turn it into drag car. Just more torque-ky deer will do.



Once done. And more ppl back to this thread then can organise K-Cars TT.

 

[4gbanger]

mine are 850 carb MT.. yeah man.. just want that extra torque abit faster than stock but high efficient and endurance as well..

make sure u do more research on your JB-JL/JB-DET selection.. get more info from sifus. i might be wrong bcos i'm no sifus. still learning.

but i can say i have quite experience with EF-JL maintenance n mod. i think u can go search for EF-RL/EF-DET engine. said to have slightly

more torque than EF-JL since its a DOHC combo with 3 cylinder. check this table.

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

mine are 850 carb MT.. yeah man.. just want that extra torque abit faster than stock but high efficient and endurance as well..

make sure u do more research on your JB-JL/JB-DET selection.. get more info from sifus. i might be wrong bcos i'm no sifus. still learning.

but i can say i have quite experience with EF-JL maintenance n mod. i think u can go search for EF-RL/EF-DET engine. said to have slightly

more torque than EF-JL since its a DOHC combo with 3 cylinder. check this table.

Ya, a guy told me EF-DET is the fastest for 3 cyclinder. Want smoother right seems the EF-RL or the JB-JL would fit the bill.

Ya need to have the extra torque but yet reliable and high efficiency. Want no engine letup or anything since is just my daily ride for now

Your's 850cc MT also kena bully? Damn, means I'm like riding a bicycle on the road

 

[4gbanger]

yup.. EF-DET/EF-RL has the highest torque for E series engine.. depend on how u drive. if u drive it long distance, get JB. if its just a city drive, get EF.. 4 cylinder smoother and alot less vibration. thats why EF-JL (L2s) shaking alot at high speed.

hahah.. i dont want anymore engine letup.. enough experience already.. i wont change the internal part unless its a kelisa/kenari 72mm piston. that would jump up my torque right? hehe.

my 850 already coughing white smoke.. its about time to do major overhaul.. might just proceed the transplant. i do wondering about mix with my 850 block. but some guy told me i need to rebore to fit the L2s piston. not sure how much the cost for rebore n the endurance..

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

yup.. EF-DET/EF-RL has the highest torque for E series engine.. depend on how u drive. if u drive it long distance, get JB. if its just a city drive, get EF.. 4 cylinder smoother and alot less vibration. thats why EF-JL (L2s) shaking alot at high speed.

hahah.. i dont want anymore engine letup.. enough experience already.. i wont change the internal part unless its a kelisa/kenari 72mm piston. that would jump up my torque right? hehe.

my 850 already coughing white smoke.. its about time to do major overhaul.. might just proceed the transplant. i do wondering about mix with my 850 block. but some guy told me i need to rebore to fit the L2s piston. not sure how much the cost for rebore n the endurance..

Yup, can change to 72mm pistons for L2 engines. Just received an advise from a friendly k-car specialist to go for L2 engines instead. Since is more potential and not so much limitations as L5 engines with 4 pistons. Easy to kaboom if mod too high.

He said won't overheat if you did not mod a car with "save more money parts mindset" Need to change the necessary parts to keep the engine tiptop and reliable.

I think you can send to him to do the transplant for you. Can pm him his number to you if you have got the engine to transplant it in. You can do 1st since you have the modal adi. I'm still gathering it

My deer will only be for city drive. Highway mostly just Kesas or LDP. Not going to take it to NSE.
Ya, like they said, want performance no comfort Means I have to give up on L5 engines.

L5 engines not advisable to go up to 150hp. Will letup.

 

[4gbanger]

base on my experience (and also logic thinking) since the L5 is a 4 cylinder engine, everything internal is small and tiny because they need to squeeze everything inside. on the other hand, EF series engine is a 3 cylinder and still have few spaces for uprgrading such as cylinder boring, oversize valve etc. but what i can say that if u want that stability, less vibration, good aircond, good power steering n maintain below 1 bar of boost without major mod just go for 4 cylinder L5. then if u want to upgrade to 150++whp with poor power steering, poor aircond and tends to overheat but eat GSR and stock evo3 for dinner u can proceed EF-JL. u will have another option that is good power steering and aircond but not much of aftermarket parts to achieve 150whp but easily achieve 110++whp is the EF-DET/EF-RL engine. u choose bro..

 

[Supra_Fanatics]

base on my experience (and also logic thinking) since the L5 is a 4 cylinder engine, everything internal is small and tiny because they need to squeeze everything inside. on the other hand, EF series engine is a 3 cylinder and still have few spaces for uprgrading such as cylinder boring, oversize valve etc. but what i can say that if u want that stability, less vibration, good aircond, good power steering n maintain below 1 bar of boost without major mod just go for 4 cylinder L5. then if u want to upgrade to 150++whp with poor power steering, poor aircond and tends to overheat but eat GSR and stock evo3 for dinner u can proceed EF-JL. u will have another option that is good power steering and aircond but not much of aftermarket parts to achieve 150whp but easily achieve 110++whp is the EF-DET/EF-RL engine. u choose bro..

Yup you are right about the 4 cylinders bro. The guy told me, to prevent overheat for L2 engines need to put in Kelisa 1000cc block and proper aluminium radiator. Track proven no problem he said.

But ya, heard a lot of ppl saying that 4 cylinder = comfort. 3 cylinder for sprinting and more power.
But ya then again l5 engines, 110whp is more than enough if really want to go to that also enough to shock many cars on the road adi. Never like too much vibrations actually. Which is why I like the kelisa. Consider the car is quiet and comfortable for a small k-car. Kancil on the other hand. Really like everything also rattle

Guess I need to install stiff rings for it. Is either EF-RL or the EF-JL for me then. Also 1 thing I like about L5 engines, using timing chain.
At least no more timing belt headache. But kelisa using timing belt :frown:

 

[twistedichc]

High five bro. How long have you bought it? Seems we have same thing in mind. A small project but interesting and worthwhile to me.

I'm looking at either JBJL or just settle with EF-RL. Just want to improve the pick up. Enough power to pulling power. Just got it for a week and already have bigger cars bullying my baby. Especially wiras tailing me Seems JBJL and EF-RL is almost same price. JBJL is newer

JBDET wise, a guy said is a good engine but then sad thing is that it has lack of R&D. His is manual 5 speed with emanage. Can rev up to 7krpm

I'm still doing research around. For me, if that's the case, I would go for JBJL. I wan't more torque. Not sure can mix and match parts from JBDET to improve it further?

Yes bro, hope more Mira and Kancil owners are coming back to this thread. Let's keep it alive. :top:

aiyah going boosting don't invite me lehh, sum say JB engine is a bit manja leehh don't know y, don't want 2 ej-de eehh, NA power

 

[4gbanger]

bro, JB engine is quite "manja" due to its tiny valve.. the valve is tends to snap when tuned to certains level. the only way to outcome is with aftermarket strengthen valve which is only found in japan and quite rare. or maybe extreme metal engineering..

 

[twistedichc]

bro, JB engine is quite "manja" due to its tiny valve.. the valve is tends to snap when tuned to certains level. the only way to outcome is with aftermarket strengthen valve which is only found in japan and quite rare. or maybe extreme metal engineering..

when u say rare, I know there is a club that focused on rarity items e.g, the ori digital dash clock, a fren told me his bro in-law bought it @1.5k for that tiny item