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<blockquote data-quote="defcon1" data-source="post: 1362720" data-attributes="member: 30064"><p>Hi Ong,</p><p></p><p>Remember how our motor is slightly rough when you start it in the morning? It's a different sort of roughness...like as though the pistons are loose. Also, remember that Cefiro's cannot use engine oil that is too light. Shell Synthetic tends to dissapear? That's because forged pistons require slightly more clearance than cast pistons and when the car is cold, they ARE, in fact, loose.</p><p></p><p>As for torque, a turbo may not be a solution for you. A turbo would have a certain degree of lag. How much lag would depend on the turbo design (flow, turbine and compressor size and weight, etc), the flow potential of the inlet/outlet manifold, downpipes and head and the responsiveness of the motor. As a rule of thumb, the larger the turbo, the greater the lag (more weight in the turbine and compressor wheels). You should expect power to kick in only above 3200 rpm. On the up side...a turbocharger would make you REACH 3200 rpm in half the time or less... :)</p><p></p><p>The good thing about our VQ's is the short stroke...76.5mm I think. A shorter stroke means a more responsive motor. A more responsive motor means a faster turbo wind-up. You could lower the rpm threshold by installing a smaller turbo. But a small turbo would not hold boost at high rpm's. What would happen would be that your max boost would be achieved from around 3k onwards to maybe 5k...but above that, you'd see your turbo pressure dropping as the motor demands more boost than the turbo could supply. You would also be over-working your turbo and that would shorten it's lifespan significantly.</p><p></p><p>Turbos for our vehicles would have to be properly matched. I calculate that we would need around 550 cfm for a 3.0l, and 450 cfm for a 2.5l. There are many, many turbo options from scrap cars that have this flow rate with prices ranging from RM200 - RM1600 for a top end ball-bearing Garrett.</p><p></p><p>The next thing we would need would be a decent intercooler. Since we are running low pressure, there would be no need to have a very large intercooler. The degree of compression is not enough for the charged air to reach the threshold temp of 55 degrees C. In fact, we could run without one, but that would loose us power as you well know, hot air is thinner and holds less O2. I estimate that with the turbo parameters I have indicated, the temp of the charged air at max pressure would be no higher than 53 degrees C. A small IC to lower the temp to the mid-40's would be enough. Lots of IC to pick up again at scrap yards that would fit nicely under our bumper at a few hundred bucks.</p><p></p><p>At 6 psi, our stock injectors (240 cc/min) and MAF would be up to the task. However, should you aspire to go higher eg. to 10 psi (max for our engines), I would strongly suggest 300ZX injectors (around 360 cc/min) and MAF. I am currently sourcing used ones in Australia. But a new MAF in Aust is around RM900 which is a fraction of Tan Chong's price. I would also suggest hardened head studs and a thicker head gasket to lower the compression ratio, but that would make your car even less responsive at low rpm's.</p><p></p><p>Finally...piping. For low power applications, there is no real need to have mandrel bends in the exhaust piping. Many turbo experts would disagree with me. The reason mandrel bends are used is to increase the flow rate of exhaust output so as to reduce turbo lag as much as possible and increase turbo efficiency. If you had a 400+ bhp motor and needed to run a huge turbo, I would agree. But a small turbo does not really need much to spin up, and the one-fifth of a second or so that you lose with MUCH cheaper normal exhaust bends is quite bearable...especially when you consider that you probably would have saved about RM1,000 here alone. Oh...and for low boost applications, our stock 2.5" exhaust would suffice so only need to custom make the piping from the 2 downpipes to turbo and back to exhaust tract. I have some pics of the mod I am talking about if you are interested.</p><p></p><p>For the air intake, mandrel bends are a must. There are sensors all throughout the air intake tract. Uneven flow means less accurate readings going to the ECU, and less air going into the motor. It would also be wise to have a cold air intake. For our cars, the air intake could be led to either the left or right of the engine bay, behind the bumper. I remember reading that every 1 degree C of heat loses you about 2 bhp.</p><p></p><p>Finally, a supercharger would be nice. But the stillen alternative that I have seen on this site costs USD 4k... :(</p><p></p><p>Ultimately, to turbo or not to turbo depends on the individual. Driving styles would have to change a little and you have to pay attention to the fluids in your car i.e. oil and water. If it's just a little more torque that you want, a cold air intake, uprated fuel pump (I hear the volvo turbo ones fit and are much higher flow than ours) coupled with a S-AFC would probably suffice. But if you want raw power under all driving conditions...then a turbo would be the way to go.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="defcon1, post: 1362720, member: 30064"] Hi Ong, Remember how our motor is slightly rough when you start it in the morning? It's a different sort of roughness...like as though the pistons are loose. Also, remember that Cefiro's cannot use engine oil that is too light. Shell Synthetic tends to dissapear? That's because forged pistons require slightly more clearance than cast pistons and when the car is cold, they ARE, in fact, loose. As for torque, a turbo may not be a solution for you. A turbo would have a certain degree of lag. How much lag would depend on the turbo design (flow, turbine and compressor size and weight, etc), the flow potential of the inlet/outlet manifold, downpipes and head and the responsiveness of the motor. As a rule of thumb, the larger the turbo, the greater the lag (more weight in the turbine and compressor wheels). You should expect power to kick in only above 3200 rpm. On the up side...a turbocharger would make you REACH 3200 rpm in half the time or less... :) The good thing about our VQ's is the short stroke...76.5mm I think. A shorter stroke means a more responsive motor. A more responsive motor means a faster turbo wind-up. You could lower the rpm threshold by installing a smaller turbo. But a small turbo would not hold boost at high rpm's. What would happen would be that your max boost would be achieved from around 3k onwards to maybe 5k...but above that, you'd see your turbo pressure dropping as the motor demands more boost than the turbo could supply. You would also be over-working your turbo and that would shorten it's lifespan significantly. Turbos for our vehicles would have to be properly matched. I calculate that we would need around 550 cfm for a 3.0l, and 450 cfm for a 2.5l. There are many, many turbo options from scrap cars that have this flow rate with prices ranging from RM200 - RM1600 for a top end ball-bearing Garrett. The next thing we would need would be a decent intercooler. Since we are running low pressure, there would be no need to have a very large intercooler. The degree of compression is not enough for the charged air to reach the threshold temp of 55 degrees C. In fact, we could run without one, but that would loose us power as you well know, hot air is thinner and holds less O2. I estimate that with the turbo parameters I have indicated, the temp of the charged air at max pressure would be no higher than 53 degrees C. A small IC to lower the temp to the mid-40's would be enough. Lots of IC to pick up again at scrap yards that would fit nicely under our bumper at a few hundred bucks. At 6 psi, our stock injectors (240 cc/min) and MAF would be up to the task. However, should you aspire to go higher eg. to 10 psi (max for our engines), I would strongly suggest 300ZX injectors (around 360 cc/min) and MAF. I am currently sourcing used ones in Australia. But a new MAF in Aust is around RM900 which is a fraction of Tan Chong's price. I would also suggest hardened head studs and a thicker head gasket to lower the compression ratio, but that would make your car even less responsive at low rpm's. Finally...piping. For low power applications, there is no real need to have mandrel bends in the exhaust piping. Many turbo experts would disagree with me. The reason mandrel bends are used is to increase the flow rate of exhaust output so as to reduce turbo lag as much as possible and increase turbo efficiency. If you had a 400+ bhp motor and needed to run a huge turbo, I would agree. But a small turbo does not really need much to spin up, and the one-fifth of a second or so that you lose with MUCH cheaper normal exhaust bends is quite bearable...especially when you consider that you probably would have saved about RM1,000 here alone. Oh...and for low boost applications, our stock 2.5" exhaust would suffice so only need to custom make the piping from the 2 downpipes to turbo and back to exhaust tract. I have some pics of the mod I am talking about if you are interested. For the air intake, mandrel bends are a must. There are sensors all throughout the air intake tract. Uneven flow means less accurate readings going to the ECU, and less air going into the motor. It would also be wise to have a cold air intake. For our cars, the air intake could be led to either the left or right of the engine bay, behind the bumper. I remember reading that every 1 degree C of heat loses you about 2 bhp. Finally, a supercharger would be nice. But the stillen alternative that I have seen on this site costs USD 4k... :( Ultimately, to turbo or not to turbo depends on the individual. Driving styles would have to change a little and you have to pay attention to the fluids in your car i.e. oil and water. If it's just a little more torque that you want, a cold air intake, uprated fuel pump (I hear the volvo turbo ones fit and are much higher flow than ours) coupled with a S-AFC would probably suffice. But if you want raw power under all driving conditions...then a turbo would be the way to go. [/QUOTE]
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