6pots Brembo with bad results.

[apek beca]

I just recently upgraded my BBK.
It's Brembo 6pots from used Porsche installed on to a VW Jetta.
The BBK comes with SSBH that good enough already.

The looks on it is just great but I'm not really satisfied with it.
The pedal feel isn't there. Braking is just upgraded abit from my original.
I've only got abit extra grip, feels spongy...

According to the guy that fixed my brakes he says that it's my BRAKE MASTER PUMP problem.
He says that my original master brake pump are designed to support 2 pots & it's a big jump from 2 to 6 pots. The pressure from my my pump is not enough. If I want a max full grip I've gotto upgrade the pump but road use is gonna give me the WANNA PUKE FEEL if I don't control my feet/pedal well...
What should I change for a better grip? There are afew things that I'm considering...

Step 1: Change the brake fluid.
I'm thinking of changing MOTUL 660 brake fluid as on the day that I installed I don't have much time & just top up with BOSH brake fluid. Change of brake fluid helps? I only understands that it's mainly to withstand higher temps. Doubtful about the higher pressure. Pls advice if it helps or not...

Step 2: Change the SSBH
The kit is from Porsche... SSBH should be good already. Is there any special specs that I should take note if I wanna change it? Maybe the size matters? I've got no idea at all about the SSBH. If this part would gives a good result then pls advice a good brand/spec.

Step 3: Change the Master Cylinder
Kosong... totally empty about this. Reading abit gets me to know that this is quite an important part for brakes. This is not only to hold the fluid right...?

Step 3: Change the Master Brake Pump
This is blast a hole in my pocket again... Hope the the about 2 solve my problem & I don't have to change it. What's a good brand for an European Car(Volkswagen)? Again I don't have much idea about it & don't have much time to research on it. Pls advice...

Pls advice if my selection of steps are right. Also pls let me know if what's best to skip to ensure results. In short... help me to save cost abit. I'm not asking too much from my brakes. Just a more confidence braking.

Driving style is not much of tailing, more of fast in fast out slipping.
Brake, accelerate, hard brake at times...
Like 160-180 then a brainless small lorry comes out overtaking a bus or something. Fast slow down...

 

[hon_cs]

yes, the guy is right. to me, 6 pot is too much. if upgrade master pump i'm not sure if your ori servo can fit or not. may i know who recommended you use 6pot? seriously this is so wrong. for a normal sedan, if you really want braking power, just use better pad and change the braided hose. no need headache of modify and waste money fit in this 6 pot.

 

[apek beca]

Actually it's to fit my driving style. Ones requirement is different than the other.
Anyway the looks is there. The caliper really stands out...

Pls advice what should I do to get more/the most out of this thing.

 

[ken yeang]

Really overkill using 6 pot. Unless you have to tame down a couple of hundred HP in your engine. 6 pots brakes very hard to fit into typical rim sizes too.

By the way, what car do you drive? Modded?

 

[ExceL]

yes, the guy is right. to me, 6 pot is too much. if upgrade master pump i'm not sure if your ori servo can fit or not. may i know who recommended you use 6pot? seriously this is so wrong. for a normal sedan, if you really want braking power, just use better pad and change the braided hose. no need headache of modify and waste money fit in this 6 pot.

Biiiiingo.

First off, is this the same mechanic that did the retrofit?, why did he continue knowing the servo was not changed as well?. If so, did he do the retrofit properly? Are the brackets strong? Is the caliper aligned square with the disc?.. oh my..

 

[ixeo]

For starters change to stainless steel braided hose. Brake fluid when fresh from a sealed bottle won't make a huge difference between cheap and expensive.

 

[kUmUcHaI 11/1]

I just going to get a 6pots too.
Until now I know that it is not about the kit only.

All sifu, let say in this 2 situation :
Evo 8 with original brembo 4 pots upgrade to 6 pots with up grade hose as well. No change in master pump or what ever.
Normal civic fd2 2.0 upgraded 6 pots ( original brake kit not 4 pots ) with upgrade hose as well. No change in master pump or what ever.

Braking performance, you expected best for 6 pots is in evo 8 due to ? Better master pump ?
( presumed better master pump in original 4 pots evo )

 

[YYC]

For best performance-cost, one should upgrade the brake servo/bump first then go for bigger brake, because you will realise the huge difference a bigger servo can bring to your braking performance. Bigger brake needs stronger braking force from the servo to work together. Truly, I have gone through both ways of brake system upgrade. You may have bigger teeth but stronger jaw is needed too.

 

[kUmUcHaI 11/1]

Ok. Ok.

 

[apek beca]

For best performance-cost, one should upgrade the brake servo/bump first then go for bigger brake, because you will realise the huge difference a bigger servo can bring to your braking performance. Bigger brake needs stronger braking force from the servo to work together. Truly, I have gone through both ways of brake system upgrade. You may have bigger teeth but stronger jaw is needed too.

Great explanation... Brake servo....
What's the good type/brand for my VW? Know a good place to get it?
I'll get more understanding on it.

 

[YYC]

Great explanation... Brake servo....
What's the good type/brand for my VW? Know a good place to get it?
I'll get more understanding on it.

Sorry bro for my inadequacy , I don't know about parts nor any mechanic who specialises in Euro car. Maybe you can get better info in Euro car section.

 

[jeremylj]

I just recently upgraded my BBK.
It's Brembo 6pots from used Porsche installed on to a VW Jetta.
The BBK comes with SSBH that good enough already.

The looks on it is just great but I'm not really satisfied with it.
The pedal feel isn't there. Braking is just upgraded abit from my original.
I've only got abit extra grip, feels spongy...

According to the guy that fixed my brakes he says that it's my BRAKE MASTER PUMP problem.
He says that my original master brake pump are designed to support 2 pots & it's a big jump from 2 to 6 pots. The pressure from my my pump is not enough. If I want a max full grip I've gotto upgrade the pump but road use is gonna give me the WANNA PUKE FEEL if I don't control my feet/pedal well...
What should I change for a better grip? There are afew things that I'm considering...

Step 1: Change the brake fluid.
I'm thinking of changing MOTUL 660 brake fluid as on the day that I installed I don't have much time & just top up with BOSH brake fluid. Change of brake fluid helps? I only understands that it's mainly to withstand higher temps. Doubtful about the higher pressure. Pls advice if it helps or not...

Step 2: Change the SSBH
The kit is from Porsche... SSBH should be good already. Is there any special specs that I should take note if I wanna change it? Maybe the size matters? I've got no idea at all about the SSBH. If this part would gives a good result then pls advice a good brand/spec.

Step 3: Change the Master Cylinder
Kosong... totally empty about this. Reading abit gets me to know that this is quite an important part for brakes. This is not only to hold the fluid right...?

Step 3: Change the Master Brake Pump
This is blast a hole in my pocket again... Hope the the about 2 solve my problem & I don't have to change it. What's a good brand for an European Car(Volkswagen)? Again I don't have much idea about it & don't have much time to research on it. Pls advice...

Pls advice if my selection of steps are right. Also pls let me know if what's best to skip to ensure results. In short... help me to save cost abit. I'm not asking too much from my brakes. Just a more confidence braking.

Driving style is not much of tailing, more of fast in fast out slipping.
Brake, accelerate, hard brake at times...
Like 160-180 then a brainless small lorry comes out overtaking a bus or something. Fast slow down...

If you feel spongy, that means the offset of the brake caliper, disc and knuckle is out. That is why it is always worth will to get aftermarket plug and play caliper. My colleague is using 8 pot K-sport brakes in his airtrek turbo with original master pump(which supports 2 pot) ,braking power was astonishing. tips, alignment of the caliper, knuckle and disc together with the flange/hub is very important to achieve good braking.

 

[apek beca]

If you feel spongy, that means the offset of the brake caliper, disc and knuckle is out. That is why it is always worth will to get aftermarket plug and play caliper. My colleague is using 8 pot K-sport brakes in his airtrek turbo with original master pump(which supports 2 pot) ,braking power was astonishing. tips, alignment of the caliper, knuckle and disc together with the flange/hub is very important to achieve good braking.

Where would be a good place to have a pro to look at my parts.
All should be okay but just not too sure about the instillation work.
I'll really appreciate this.

 

[vr2turbo]

I just recently upgraded my BBK.
It's Brembo 6pots from used Porsche installed on to a VW Jetta.
The BBK comes with SSBH that good enough already.

The looks on it is just great but I'm not really satisfied with it.
The pedal feel isn't there. Braking is just upgraded abit from my original.
I've only got abit extra grip, feels spongy...
Spongy?, Have you done bleeding of the brake system?

According to the guy that fixed my brakes he says that it's my BRAKE MASTER PUMP problem.
He says that my original master brake pump are designed to support 2 pots & it's a big jump from 2 to 6 pots. The pressure from my my pump is not enough. If I want a max full grip I've gotto upgrade the pump but road use is gonna give me the WANNA PUKE FEEL if I don't control my feet/pedal well...
What should I change for a better grip? There are afew things that I'm considering...
If the brakes are too strong it can be dangerous when in panic situation, but yours do comes with ABS right?

Step 1: Change the brake fluid.
I'm thinking of changing MOTUL 660 brake fluid as on the day that I installed I don't have much time & just top up with BOSH brake fluid. Change of brake fluid helps? I only understands that it's mainly to withstand higher temps. Doubtful about the higher pressure. Pls advice if it helps or not...
To me, no need use Motul (expensive) unless you are track kaki. A good dot 4 brake fluid or higher dot 5.1 brake fluid is good enough

Step 2: Change the SSBH
The kit is from Porsche... SSBH should be good already. Is there any special specs that I should take note if I wanna change it? Maybe the size matters? I've got no idea at all about the SSBH. If this part would gives a good result then pls advice a good brand/spec.

Step 3: Change the Master Cylinder
Kosong... totally empty about this. Reading abit gets me to know that this is quite an important part for brakes. This is not only to hold the fluid right...?
Can a larger master cylinder fit to your current master brake pump (servo). Usually if Master cylinder is not big enough the brake pedal feel is lower. Master cylinder is to pump pressure into the brake caliper, therefore if cylinder is small the brake pedal feel is lower because require more fluid to be pump to caliper

Step 3: Change the Master Brake Pump
This is blast a hole in my pocket again... Hope the the about 2 solve my problem & I don't have to change it. What's a good brand for an European Car(Volkswagen)? Again I don't have much idea about it & don't have much time to research on it. Pls advice...
Again as mentioned, what bigger servo can fit in. Best is always from same make. For eg. Proton 1.3 and 1.6 have different size servo and fitting the 1.6 ones to the 1.3 will gain some braking. Maybe you can check out the Passat CC, Sirocco ones or even the R specs one.
Another way is to add an aftermarket servo. This one can plug and play, but not sure of VW brake system as this can be done on Jap and Korean cars


Pls advice if my selection of steps are right. Also pls let me know if what's best to skip to ensure results. In short... help me to save cost abit. I'm not asking too much from my brakes. Just a more confidence braking.

Driving style is not much of tailing, more of fast in fast out slipping.
Brake, accelerate, hard brake at times...
Like 160-180 then a brainless small lorry comes out overtaking a bus or something. Fast slow down...

You can also try better brake pads. I changed from my Bendix Metal King Titanium to Trestor Blue Advantage and the brake feel is so much better now.....

 

[Izso]

If you feel spongy, that means the offset of the brake caliper, disc and knuckle is out. That is why it is always worth will to get aftermarket plug and play caliper. My colleague is using 8 pot K-sport brakes in his airtrek turbo with original master pump(which supports 2 pot) ,braking power was astonishing. tips, alignment of the caliper, knuckle and disc together with the flange/hub is very important to achieve good braking.

Ahpek : Jeremy has a good point. Are these Brembo's plug and play on your car? If not I suspect there was some fabrication work done to craft out a support bracket meaning it probably was done quite poorly if a 6 pot feels like your ori 2 pot.

I really think you should take out those Brembos and reuse your original calipers first, then find a master fabricator to retrofit these 6potters properly.

 

[ExceL]

Where would be a good place to have a pro to look at my parts.
All should be okay but just not too sure about the instillation work.
I'll really appreciate this.

...i'll just leave it at that.

 

[apek beca]

Guess that it's the bleeding part that gone wrong.
There's not much time then. Anyway I'll bring it in for a change of the DOT5.1 fluid.
Thanks for the advice on this.
It's also the main thing that I have in mind that's might have gone wrong.

As for the BBK there are excellent results that are used on tracks with my same kits.
VW main upgrading kits are with Porsche's 6 pots BBK, highly recommended by VW kaki in forums.
As for my BBK I didn't check if it's being moded yet.
All I know that my pads are using Brembo ori pads.

I'll change the fliud 1st then sees how it goes.
Also I'll call my service center technical adviser on the upgrade on my servo.
1.4TSI to 2.0TSI specs.

Thanks to all...

 

[vr2turbo]

Guess that it's the bleeding part that gone wrong.
There's not much time then. Anyway I'll bring it in for a change of the DOT5.1 fluid.
Thanks for the advice on this.
It's also the main thing that I have in mind that's might have gone wrong.

As for the BBK there are excellent results that are used on tracks with my same kits.
VW main upgrading kits are with Porsche's 6 pots BBK, highly recommended by VW kaki in forums.
As for my BBK I didn't check if it's being moded yet.
All I know that my pads are using Brembo ori pads.

I'll change the fliud 1st then sees how it goes.
Also I'll call my service center technical adviser on the upgrade on my servo.
1.4TSI to 2.0TSI specs.

Thanks to all...

Is the 2.0 ones much bigger??

 

[apek beca]

That another thing that I'm not too sure off.
If it's not the sure it's the fluid or instillation problem.

I've tried the same BBK on a 2.0 Golf GTI.
Just asking the technical adviser would know.
If same then I'm sending it in again asking the installer to recheck/redo

 

[apek beca]

Update on solving problem:
I guess that's it's fair that I share with all of what happened.
After all there are so many commented & supported on this.
It's only fair that I chip in the update.
Thanks to all for helping.

When I got it installed it was late. Learned that don't rush or do anything at late hours.
Always ask how long it need to get it fixed & send in your car much earlier.

Problem solved:
From my personal view I guess that it's bleeding problem.(just my 2 cents)
I send it in for a change of brake fluid(5.1) & asked em to bleed all 4 sides all over again.

Also I've got a friend that newly bought a new set of BBK.
The seller add in SSBH for the rear in the package.
Sounds funny... There gotto be a reason to it. I just did the same.
Change the brake fluid & rear SSBH...Problem solved!!!
Results was from 1/2 way to the floor for max steeping, it reduced to about 1/3 only.

Personal view:
I'm not a pro & this is my 1st modded car.
I came to understands that rear brakes only supports about 20% grip.
Why change the rear SSBH? Pressure/Heat unbalanced?
What can't goes to the front kick back/expends to the rear?
Causing expending..? What ever it is it's the unbalanced that I changed the SSBH.

The SSBH part is just only a small matter only.
Main one is to bleed all four... This should be the main answer to it.
Anyone that got this problem I recommend the 1st step to over come it is to do this.
Cheap & no parts changed...
Maybe just a bottle of brake fluid. Cheapest of all part concerning brakes.