But police also have the responsibility to make sure the person under his/her custody is safe. If they found the detainee suffering or almost dying. They must call for medical help and try to revive him/her. For me, I have to say that a police must change his/her role according to situation during duty. I don't watch HK movie but I was in a mexican restaurant in LA when a police chase happen in front of the restaurant...I saw the police trying to apprehend a criminal and that guy fall down hard on the pavement face 1st and he was bleeding from his forehead...The police cuff him and ask him if he's ok then another officer radio in for a paramedic on the scene as the guy was bleeding quite badly...after the medic patch him up only then the police send him to the station.....This is what I saw in real life....Aiyo, the police job at that moment was to control then dismiss the crowd. Any of them lending a helping hand, may face serious disciplinary action due to their act may cause danger to the whole team. Police and army is not like other job when they are on a special mission. I guess most of the people know that. HK movie teach us a lot.
10-20 per group of polis equipped with stick facing uncountable heads. Honestly, I'm glad I'm not one of the police. If equip with gatling gun then maybe ok.But police also have the responsibility to make sure the person under his/her custody is safe. If they found the detainee suffering or almost dying. They must call for medical help and try to revive him/her. For me, I have to say that a police must change his/her role according to situation during duty. I don't watch HK movie but I was in a mexican restaurant in LA when a police chase happen in front of the restaurant...I saw the police trying to apprehend a criminal and that guy fall down hard on the pavement face 1st and he was bleeding from his forehead...The police cuff him and ask him if he's ok then another officer radio in for a paramedic on the scene as the guy was bleeding quite badly...after the medic patch him up only then the police send him to the station.....This is what I saw in real life....
so I don't trust movies....
I hope you are not saying those who have attended the rally took the bait, hook and sinker, are you?I support their demands. But I'll not blindly support anything they dish out on the table.
There is a restaurant in a town and that is the only restaurant so everyone has to eat their meals there everyday. The boss of the restaurant know this is the only place for the resident so he started to serve shitty food and charging more and more. The residents become very unhappy, and they keep telling each other they will go somewhere else someday and make this restaurant out of business so the boss will change. But day after day, the residents continue to come back and pay the ever raising food price for the more and more shitty food. They hope someone will make the boss change, but not themself because they still wanna have their meal in this only restaurant and they scare to offend the boss or their seats will be taken away by other.
Oneday, a few residents finally think they cant tolerate anymore so they decided to confront to the boss together in the restaurant. The boss know about this and warn that they should not complain anything in the restaurant because it is not right. In the end, few guys really confront to the boss together but they were beaten and chase away by the boss. Some other residents who did not join the argue complain that these guys are affecting the atmosphere of the restaurant and there should be other more peaceful way to make the boss aware on what he is doing. So they decided to keep quiet but order less food to show their anger......so it can be peaceful and still showing they are unhappy about the restaurant service without making the boss angry.
That restaurant is call msia, their neighbouring town thailand restaurant just change a new boss last month because their customer group together and chase the previous boss out. The opposite town spore just changed their old chief 2 months ago because their customer complain that their old chief try to force them to eat something they dont like.
msia is a very peaceful restaurant because everyone will not do something which the boss say they cannot do inside the restaurant so they continue to serve the food as good as shit but charging more with order below minimum billing amount. So the resident of this msia restaurant has a new idea, they will really eat shit inside the restaurant to show the boss that they are unhappy with the food.
that is not the guy who passed away. the guy you saw in the video was another guy who had a seizure. :wavey:CSL, the death occurred somewhere in the end of the rally the crowd has already dispersed ....there were a group police with people around and some passerby...the deceased was handcuffed already at the moment. That time he was still moving but slowly slipping away...the people and reporter around was asking for a tool from the police to cut away the cable tie handcuff on the detainee's wrist (the police replied, I don't have a tool to open it) and a guy was telling the police to radio in the medic but the police just stand there and look at the guy...
wow, didn't know u so big shot that others must reply to you...Till date, they still cannot answer me why cannot delay the date a bit, change location, obtain a permit and do a proper demonstration as per what they announce earlier on.
not sure as i was at Maybank, about 200m away. i only knew about this when i saw the video.Mizu,,opsss...sorry....but how was the guy that got seizure? was he ok?
yeah, since the police car only came 25 minutes later, there could be permanent brain damage :(I wish the guy that got seizure a speedy recovery...
CSL, the death occurred somewhere in the end of the rally the crowd has already dispersed ....there were a group police with people around and some passerby...the deceased was handcuffed already at the moment. That time he was still moving but slowly slipping away...the people and reporter around was asking for a tool from the police to cut away the cable tie handcuff on the detainee's wrist (the police replied, I don't have a tool to open it) and a guy was telling the police to radio in the medic but the police just stand there and look at the guy...
I hope you are not saying those who have attended the rally took the bait, hook and sinker, are you?
I simply cannot appreciate what you were trying to convey here dude, seriously. Maybe my comprehension needs an update and I will agree to disagree with you.It was not a bait. Technically they never cheat people. Due to the time is short and things too complicated, they just forgot to tell something as TDM also occasionally do. And people just simply completed the puzzle by their own. They never urge people to fight against police, but people just unable to control their emotion and did it.
Above will be the answer if put the leaders in the court.
Again, if there was no rally, nothing will be happen. Even 4th party also has no chance to do anything bad. If they get a permit and do a successful demonstration as per everyone wish, then they will lose a chance to hit BN, cuz Najib already open mouth and promise a stadium, so credit will goes to him. Of cause, I don't know if Bersih still neutral. But no doubt the the rally was under the Bersih flag. They have the responsibility for everything.
It is not that my mouth is bad, but if you wanna join illegal rally, please think deeply. Bait or not bait is not important. You should care about those person you love or those are/will depends on you in order to live, eg children, parents and etc. There are many way to fight. But before you make the decision, you must 1st finish your responsibility. If you wanna have 2nd round, go ask insurance company whether you are covered if attend an illegal rally. This is a very serious matter. That's why I suggested earlier on for using alternative way to voice out. Now I think it is even better, if stop all rally or demo, everyone send letter or post card, write there I demand for bla bla bla, to The Agong or PM or even newspaper (CNN too?) once a week until the election regulation changed. 1 month cost less than a pack of cigarette or a cup of cappuccino. I believe the pressure is far greater than a memorandum. If floating all minister facebook acc with the 8 demands, it should be cost almost nothing. They have to do something if wanna grab back their 'cyber territory'
I strongly against any illegal rally or demo. Foreign moon doesn't mean have to be rounder. We don't do it in their way doesn't mean we are not cool or not advance enough. We should show them we are more civilized. We should show them our maths is better.
Change boss maybe good, although he is 3 headed. You never know if you never try. I heard about bumi from east Malaysia are complaining about those indonesia and philipino people can get blue IC very easy and they are not happy with it. In a case, when a person went and check the name list, surprisingly he found he had extra 40+ family members don't know come from where. But regardless how, Bersih's demand is 100% neutral thing and I really support it. It should be above politics. It should be not sided any party. But what happen? Same to us, we should be stand at the neutral side. Both BN and opposition are just a party that we assign as our manager with 4-5 years contract. Anyone has the rights to support any of them or even don't support at all. If they do it right, support. If they do it wrong, voice out. No point to protect them with thick armor just because of personal interest or even sugar coating whatever they did regardless right or wrong, just to influence others to materialize your wish.
1. Does freedom of 10k or above volume of people more important than 1 non involved personnel safety?
2. If situation lost control, does the gov need to pay the bill and take the blame? If not, who will pay the bill and take the responsibility and how?
If freedom is above everything, why we need law? The existence of the permit system is to make sure if anything goes wrong, the damage can be reduce to the minimum at the shortest time. That including organize various parties like polis, hospital, traffic related dept, fire dept, emergency respond team and etc. Each of them will send a rep and have a meeting, open the map, discuss and make the final decision. If Bersih announce only 10-20 people demo, I guess it will be a lot easier. But what amount they told the world?
Does Bersih respect anyone who do business at that area or even care about the safety of any pass by innocent?
I support their demands. But I'll not blindly support anything they dish out on the table. Let's say the rally had successfully breach the police barrier and reach Stadium Merdeka, does it mean that they win and the election committee must do according to the demands immediately? It is not a rugby match that can straight go to the stage and take the prize. Does sending a memorandum need to be so desperate until like what had happen?
Till date, they still cannot answer me why cannot delay the date a bit, change location, obtain a permit and do a proper demonstration as per what they announce earlier on. Why not just contact them and ask then put the answer here? Let everyone to justify if their move is a must or there is an agenda behind.
---------- Post added at 10:41 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 10:19 PM ----------
10-20 per group of polis equipped with stick facing uncountable heads. Honestly, I'm glad I'm not one of the police. If equip with gatling gun then maybe ok.
Sometimes I do wonder if you actually know what you are trying to say or just shooting around at point blank bro.It may sound bad but if I'm the police, I'll not even open my mouth to respond anything. Just focus on what had been assigned. If I too busybody, somehow me or the medic become a hostage, then the price need to pay may be own or innocent life or even worst. Too many possibilities and uncertainties in a battle. Who can guaranty no 4th party standby for an opportunity to create extra issues for political gain?
The whole police force no doubt will be blamed. People will instinctly side the weaker party. But regardless how, their responsibility at that moment was to control the situation. You cannot sue them or do anything. But if there is a permit, then different story. The police which is the permit issuer has to take full responsibility. Even if you fall down and not receive medical attendance within reasonable time, you can complaint or even sue them. They have to apologize or even pay you compensation. That is why do things legal is very important.
yes...agree with that....the imbalance of act...especially with something that could put the career of ppl in control above in jeopardy....I'm quite puzzled actually. I'm not siding any party or any political party. When they police say."The rally will cause trouble and affect business, traffic jam this and that disrupted..Then I wonder won't those Le Tour De Langkawi, new year count down or those 10~15KM marathon give the same effect...since those event also need to close off roads for hours, causes traffic jams, business effected...etc...Why give permit since they also bring the same effect to the people not participating...
Just imagine if the police discuss with the organizer, set up a route for the rally (a fixed route) to the destination..Just like Marathon or Le Tour De Langkawi also got a fixed route...then just control the traffic and close off certain roads for the marchers and let the people march towards their destination then after that let them finish their business in their destination...then the rally would be over very quickly...Since we can see the effects of not allowing street rally which always turn out ugly. Why not for once try to give them a green light and see how it goes? Never try, never know right?