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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Useless" data-source="post: 1291614" data-attributes="member: 670">fandango,from my personal experience, the piggyback does not know when it is open/close loop as of the ecu operations. most of the piggybacks out there are upstream modificators in the control system. i do get instant response if i enrich maximum fuel or retard maximum ignition on several systems i have tried. and these were done at sub 4000 rpm range.i believe why we cant feel much changes in close loop is because the tolerance till error code is quite huge. and the range of correction is somewhat large for a particular operating condition.i think that ecu will continue to 'learn" be it in open/close loop. just that the "amount of things being input" differs. but than again i might be wrong.if there is an repeatable errorneous log detected by the engine ecu, it will revert to an open loop."So what if an erro code pops up during open loop operation that requires fuel trim or timing retardation? Will the piggy recognise this and let the ecu take over? :retarded: If not, will the engine go kaboom??:shocked:"if i gathered correctly, there are lesser fuel trim changes in open loop as compared to close loop. ecu switches maps depending on load and other factors. timing retardation is determined by knock sensor in open loop. and the final part, piggyback cannot recognise anything; its just a dummy inserted to perform addition/subtraction between sensor and ecu. yes, engines do kaboom even with piggybacks installed."so the benefit of higher res maps is not readily noticeable, esp for lightly modded cars? do you consider this to be lightly modded:1. Metal gasket (1.2mm - 0.8mm)2. Shaved head (0.5mm?)3. Balanced crank and rods4. Aftermarket flywheel5. Adjustable fuel pressure regulator6. Stock cams and pulleys (intake vvt only)will consumption improve if I install a wideband lambda sensor with a compatible piggyback? Or it's only good for a standalaone?"i think ur mods are light. an adjustable fuel pressure regulator is ur greatest safety tool. generally, raise the entire fuel curve up when CR is increased, then optimizing fueling with piggyback is the easier path.narrow band lambda is built for the ecu to see 14.7. wideband informs about upstream exhaust gas mixture. i cannot see how can consumption be significantly improved when narrow vs wide is applied; given that both are of the same condition. consumption is governed by the obedience of the right foot, engine specs, engine condition, etc. WB is used with standalones because its the only thing to tune with easily.at this point after re-re-re-re-reading the email u posted, i think what he tried to say is that piggybacks can alter both open and close loop conditions. "With precision electronic control, we can make both a smoother running and efficient engine (in closed loop) and maximum power (in open loop)" p/s- i think things are getting very subjective already. will try hard to revert back to the original topic. hehe.:_:  rgdsuseless</blockquote>

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