Indianapolis Mishap

[hyper_tuner]

Indianapolis Grand Prix 19th June

Come on guys...feel me in.

What do u guys think?
Why couldnt the Michelin teams race?
Why is FIA so stubborn by not letting a chicane be made in order to slow the cars down?
This the worst scenario I have ever experienced watching F1...I am also very dissappointed with FIA's decision...I know that u cant race if it concerns drivers safety...but fans are very unhappy....

Lets hope this doesnt affect F1 badly in the future......

 

[butthead]

Indianapolis Grand Prix 19th June

Come on guys...feel me in.

What do u guys think?
Why couldnt the Michelin teams race?
Why is FIA so stubborn by not letting a chicane be made in order to slow the cars down?
This the worst scenario I have ever experienced watching F1...I am also very dissappointed with FIA's decision...I know that u cant race if it concerns drivers safety...but fans are very unhappy....

Lets hope this doesnt affect F1 badly in the future......

personally i think the teams made the wise decision...pulling out seems to gave advantage to certain teams...but would u risk driver injury or even more severely spectator deaths...if this were to happen Michellins would ave everything to be blamed for for not advising the cars to stay out...they could end up in lawsuits...it is US u know...

the Michellins could not have raced due to the risk that they had structural damages in their tyres...they had brought the tyres of several teams down to their MIchellin facilities somewhere in the states to do a complete analysis of the tyre...which in the end they found out was not safe to race...they decided not to risk even their second compound and went to advise teams not to take part on race day...the structural damage would have caused high speed collisions to happen on the "brick yard"...remember Ralf last year or the year before...i think he ended up in hospital for crashin into the wall...

FIA is not stubborn...and dun start blaming Ferrari or anyone in fact for this chicane matter...i dun think FIA had the time to lay down a chicane as they only got to know the final result yesterday morning i think...Ferrari had their right to disagree to the decisions made by the MIchellin runners...do you think Michellin runners would do the same for bridgestone runners if they were in the reverse positions??? how many percentage of the tyre failure risk would be lowered with jus a chicane built...the tyres got litereally sturture damage with jus a number of laps done...imagine completing a 70+ lap race...doesn't this sound risky where human lives is in involved...

although this is the worst scenario...and fans are unhappy...they did not do their fair share of responsibility either...they were throwing beer bottles and cups and anything they could get hold of on the track...at least some teams came out to uphold the honour of the sport...they could have easily jus went into the pits thinking that did not had competitors...but they came out not to left the spectators hanging in the middle...

 

[[Joc]]

hyper tuner, i don't think you really want pple to 'feel' u in.... do you? ;)

butthead, i think there are mobile chicanes now, and they are quite easily installed. How much better can the tyre take it for 73 laps when it burst in only a few laps? Well i think really a lot, because if they are speeding on the main straight, it shouldn't be a problem. But at that banked turn, the loadings are different on the tyres. Especially the shear stress between the tyre's road contact patch and the side walls. If they were speeding on a straight and not on a banked turn, the loadings would not be longitudinal, hence not ripping the tyre off the side walls. I do agree Michelin has not done a very good job at all here, but apparently Bridgestone had a preview on the new surface of the track during one of Bridgestone's last month event at the same circuit, so i guess they were notified of the more abrasive surface than say Michelin were. That's what i heard from Martin and James (ITV commentators) anyway. Oh well, just a big joke of a race i guess.

 

[hyper_tuner]

Opinions

Seriously guys, I think FIA is being too strict with their regulations, and they have to come to a conclusion that all teams should run using only one brand. Before Michelin came, Bridgestone was doing not so bad of a job after Good Year left F1. Since tire usage are very crucial, FIA needs to take this matter very much into consideration. Well thats what I think. Thanks for replying guys.

 

[edgar_raphael]

adding chicane would not help. you cannot predict that accidents wont happened if you add a chicane.

yes, butthead is right, FIA is not stubborn and not about the matter of time allowance to add the chicane, it is about how can you prove if it really can help. The only solution is the get the Michellin runners off the track.

I think they learned a lesson here, although the solution was not the best anyone would expect for now. A valuable lesson for next time they would know how to take care of this situation.

 

[butthead]

hyper tuner, i don't think you really want pple to 'feel' u in.... do you? ;)

butthead, i think there are mobile chicanes now, and they are quite easily installed. How much better can the tyre take it for 73 laps when it burst in only a few laps? Well i think really a lot, because if they are speeding on the main straight, it shouldn't be a problem. But at that banked turn, the loadings are different on the tyres. Especially the shear stress between the tyre's road contact patch and the side walls. If they were speeding on a straight and not on a banked turn, the loadings would not be longitudinal, hence not ripping the tyre off the side walls. I do agree Michelin has not done a very good job at all here, but apparently Bridgestone had a preview on the new surface of the track during one of Bridgestone's last month event at the same circuit, so i guess they were notified of the more abrasive surface than say Michelin were. That's what i heard from Martin and James (ITV commentators) anyway. Oh well, just a big joke of a race i guess.

yes mobile chicanes...Monaco uses those i think...but i think they were running short of time to set it up...and they would need to let the cars run again to get their set-ups right...even without the high speed banking load... it is not totally 100% sure that the tyres will not fail...if it is Michellin would have came out to back the teams decisions...they would not want to be blamed for any accidents...

 

[speeddemon3500]

hey guys...im new to this forum...
i dont think its right to blame any particular side for the us gp fiasco, but then the people who i feel should take a bit of the responsibility would be the FIA. they simply refused to compromise on a few rules that might have saved the grand prix;

1. in today's newspaper (NST - 20/6/05, so it was written pre-race) it was stated that even if michelin's other tyre (they took 2 different ones to the race) could've witheld the loads on those final corners, the FIA would penalise any teams that switched tyres. we now know that both compounds were actually unsuitable, but IF the alternative compound was safe to use, would the FIA have allowed its usage without penalising anyone?

2. in the same article it was also stated that the FIA stopped a new batch of tires from being sent to the US from the michelin factory in France. im not going to comment on why the FIA did this but surely they mustve been aware of the seriousness of the situation by then

finally i cant believe ferrari voted down the idea of a chicane. at least the FIA actually considered this option seriously. as a ferrari fan and a race fan, this is very disheartening to me. ferrari didnt win the us GP on merit, they won by default. this is not what racing is supposed to be about.
but enough about ferrrari, somehow i feel that the FIA already decided on running 6 cars for the race long before the cars lined up on the grid. the FIA waited until after the parade lap to bring michelin runners into the pits, because (if im not mistaken) the rules state that an absolute minimum of 20 cars must line up on the grid for a GP (correct me if im wrong, but i think this is what they had on their minds). i think thats why they were all classified as 'DNF' instead of 'not raced' or something.

all in all, a very disappointing day.

 

[minivan]

It was'nt the FIA that called the michellin runners in, it was the call of the teams.They did this after the warm up lap, coz if they did'nt start at all for no apparent reason (as far as the FIA was concern, there was no reason for teams to pull out), the teams would have to face a fine. So they run one lap (cukup syarat) than pull out...

 

[xtracooljustin]

dont start to blame FIA or Ferrari.

Michelin would have gone ahead wif da race if Bridgestone was in their position. Rules by FIA are meant to be adhered too. Wat good is da rules if its meant to be broken?

IMHO, the only solution for this fiasco was to have this race on another day using the same qualifiying positions. At least the fans wont feel shortchanged.

 

[SpeedWanker]

I feel the only party to be blame here is Michelin for not providing a suitable tire for the race hence making it dangerous for all Michelin users to race but as all gentlemen do, they admitted fault and appologize..

IMO no modification should be simply done on any point of the circuit without proper study, design and inspection of the layout and the safety aspect of the circuit. Usually all F1 circuits are inspected weeks or months before each race to ensure the safety of all drivers and changing the design of the circuit at the very last minute, i.e on sunday morning is not a very wise thing to do.

It was also right for FIA to stand their ground for all teams have agreed on such regulations before the start of the race and should not be changed just because..

As for Ferrari i think they should not be "fingered" for going on with the race coz to not race is like giving away a million dollars that u've just won.. as butthead says, i guess he's right about Michelin not wanting to backoff if bridgestone is having a problem
:p:rolleyes:

 

[xtracooljustin]

I feel the only party to be blame here is Michelin for not providing a suitable tire for the race hence making it dangerous for all Michelin users to race but as all gentlemen do, they admitted fault and appologize..

IMO no modification should be simply done on any point of the circuit without proper study, design and inspection of the layout and the safety aspect of the circuit. Usually all F1 circuits are inspected weeks or months before each race to ensure the safety of all drivers and changing the design of the circuit at the very last minute, i.e on sunday morning is not a very wise thing to do.

It was also right for FIA to stand their ground for all teams have agreed on such regulations before the start of the race and should not be changed just because..

As for Ferrari i think they should not be "fingered" for going on with the race coz to not race is like giving away a million dollars that u've just won.. as butthead says, i guess he's right about Michelin not wanting to backoff if bridgestone is having a problem
:p:rolleyes:

ditto bro... well said there... exactly wat i had in mind too... cos it seems evybody is fingering Ferrari n FIA which is getting me all worked-up... makes me think that a lot of ppl here dun c da bigger picture...

 

[cyclonite]

yeah xtracooljustin you've got a very good answer to that. They could even have it next weekend as the next race is 2 weeks ahead.

Anyways, to stop ALL CARS from running wouldn't be fair to Bridgestone and Ferrari's sponsors also. Imagine Bridgestone goes to the press and says they already knew about this condition at Indianapolis and spent a couple of million making sure their tyres can take the conditions but then the FIA didn't allow them to run just coz of the Michelin runners?
Also, Ferrari's sponsors would have wanted them to run and put some miledge and advertisement for them also. So it's not so easy just to pull out of a race. I think if Minardi really did that, they would have been less creditable to their sponsors too

 

[XXX]

I put the blame solely on Michelin and the Michelin shod teams. If they had lousy tires then instead of doing 1.13's they can do 1.16's and still do the race but no their rival must also go slow as slow as them. Why has Ferrari or the others with better tyres have to go slow as well???. The whole thing happenned bcos the majority were on Michelins and they thought they could get away with it. Now lets change the scenario if Ferrari had lousy tires from bridgestone that day can they go around asking for a 5 lap advantage bcos their tire supplier brought lousy tires.I rest my case. Im no Ferrari fan but a fan of the sport called Formula 1.

 

[cyclonite]

As the summon statement reads:

"Formula One is a sporting contest. It must operate to clear rules. These cannot be negotiated each time a competitor brings the wrong equipment to a race.