Engine oil getting lesser

[mengz]

instead of adding additive to make the viscosity go higher, y not just get an engine oil which has high viscosity? i remember i read somewhere when an engine oil contains too much Viscosity Index Improvers(VI), under high temp & shear forces, the molecules of the VI tend to change shape thus lowering the quality of the engine oil gradually. also, how much viscosity will the oil additive add? what brand issit u using? does it state clearly by adding how much, ur bringing up the viscosity by how much?

also, ur above post, u said a car with shell helix ultra will lose more than shell helix plus and super. i think u kinda misunderstood engine oil viscosity. actually, shell helix ultra and shell helix plus both are 15w50, only difference is one is fully-syn and the other is semi-syn. shell helix super is 20w50. the only difference is the W which doesnt make much difference here in malaysia. so how come shell helix ultra loses more engine oil than the other 2? all 3 engine oils are 50 viscosity at operating temp. so why do u say shell helix super has the highest viscosity?

 

[vantageX]

as said earlier, oil tends to slip-in to the combustion chamber due to piston rings wear and tear(this applied to new cars also). If the gap is small, the slip-in is less which is my car facing now. The addative is not used to stop leak, is used to make the visco higher, so if the car is running with the engine oil is hot(maybe 70°C), it will not so fast and easy to slip-in to combustion chamber. Thus the oil will not lost in short time. If really a big leak where using addative also cannot control, is better to do top overhaul.

I asked about No Smoke because No Smoke is used to help cars with smoking problems hence the name. It works by temporarily sealing the gaps between the piston rings and cylinder walls and in other words stopping the leak of engine oil into the combustion chambers and stopping the smoke.

But because its poured into the engine, it also mixes with the oil and viscosity becomes higher. But in a car with a smoking problem it doesn't matter because the car is already losing power because of the compression loss thru the pistons. With the oil being thicker, the compression is returned and so is the power.

 

[kyheng]

I don't want to argue much on this, as before I change to Wira, I drive a 94 Iswara, all the above mentioned oil I have used without adding addative. The result is using fully syn-oil have to top up another 2liters after 2 weeks, semi-syn have to top up 1liter after 1month and lowest grade no need to add. I complete 5000km around 3months or lesser. You can find out this with your mech on how true is my statements.
Another thing is if I not mistaken, the engine oil temp is more 50°C when the car is running.
http://www.twf8.ws/new/tech/tip/enginetemp.html
Just get the info from this website, the temperature is at 90-110°C.
If use the lowest grade for 3 years engine, you will feel that your car is abit heavy and response slower, if use syn oil you can feel that your car is like flying.
Frankly speaking I don't know what is the 15w50 or 20w50 stands for, maybe like you say I misunderstand it(I'm sorry for this) But I'm type of man that try and error, futher info you can check below website:
http://www.bpoil.co.za/products/engine/vanellus/c6global.htm
From the spec(10w40) you can see at ambient temp the visco is 106, when at
100°C the visco is 14.
You can also check Shell's website for the correct oil for the age of a car:
http://www.shell.com/home/PlainPage..._lubricants/helix_new/app_choose_ga_0312.html
You see, they only recommend you to use lowest grade for a 10 year car. Why they never ask you to use shell helix ultra?
http://www.blackstone-labs.com/oil_viscosity.html
I have read few times already on this, I cannot understand it... Haha.
From the above article also they not recommend we to use the addative. But the addative that I buy normally is around 50-100ml or lesser, brand NASA. maybe if the addative keep too long it will degrade, but my usage is fast, every change only takes 3months or lesser. I only come across to use the addative when I know that the engine oil lost 20% after 3 months. So after adding it, the lost is around 5% now, without performance drop, I have use 1 time the lowest grade and I feel my car abit heavy.

 

[vantageX]

Nah, not arguing here, just a fascinating topic. I guess nobody is right and wrong here and even the most experienced mechanic can't tell what the best solution here. There are so many variations to play around with, temperature, driving style, condition of engine, tune of engine, types of oil, additives and so on and so forth.

However, I do have to disagree with Shell's system of recommending oils based on just the age of a car. Eventhough a car is new, it can still have an old design engine in it or the other way around, an old car with a revolutionary engine for its time. I guess for the average car user out there the Shell guide is ok but I don't think we should take it too seriously. The other websites are a good read though and should be read by anyone wanting to learn more about engine oils.

 

[kyheng]

Yeah, but basically, old car cannot use fully syntactic oil because of low viscocity or too light in another term. You can try without adding ant addatives, but don't regret after this. The Shell system fault is they never tell us why old car cannot use syntactic oil. Being a company that selling luboil, not only Shell, they should speficy more clearly on this, atleast we will be more aware.
Another thing that you get it wrong abit is the engine oil used is corresponding to the age of engine, not the age of car. So the design of the engine is not a matter.
I think is better that we test around with the oils(syn, semi, standard) then we make the conclusion ourself. The process might be long(1year) but atleast we know which oil is better for our car engine.
Back to the topic, this is 1 of the main cause that we lost the engine oil if wrong grade is used.

 

[mengz]

bro, not arguing here....we're here for a reason. to discuss & find solution :0 so if i offended u any how, im sorry.

back to the topic. ermmmm, i really have no idea y shell advice users like that. but i've came across other sites that says to use a thicker viscosity oil for older engines, due to the gaps being wider after wear & tear & newer engines or new design engines that has tighter bearings can use lower viscosity oil. so this sounds more logical, instead of saying use fully-syn for new engine, semi-syn for old engine, mineral for older engine. doesnt make sense, coz its the viscosity that we're interested abt, not its base stock.

 

[kyheng]

Not yet being offended, so is ok for me. Sometimes when we think tilted abit, it will become war zone here, haha.
Shell advise like this because they don't people to know that what is their actual visco. Another thing is, I don't what brand you are using, and have changed how many brands. But for performance wise, in budget matter, other brand like Castrol or Duckhams can outbeat Shell at the same range.

 

[mengz]

im using Q8 semi-syn 10w40 every 5000km. its price:performance ratio meets my expectation so all is good.

 

[kyheng]

What brand is Q8? Mine is using Castrol Magnectic.

 

[mengz]

Q8 is the brand, its actually a kuwaity company, hence the name Q8=kuwait. rhymes doesnt it? :) but the oil is manufactured in europe.

im switching to redline on my nxt oil change. was thinking of doing an engine flush with normal mineral oil for like 5 flushes, to clean the engine b4 pouring in the redline....hmmm

 

[nonameNo]

IMHO, if can, pls dont flush the engine so often. in long run, it will damage the engine inside - slowly... coz the engine flush chemical is very strong which will remove all the dirt inside... imagine how powerful is it and you not sure how the engine component or engine seal will react to it...

 

[kyheng]

For me, I will not do any, as long as we service our car every 5000km, then the problem is less. Some company selling some luboil addative that say can last you for 10-20k, the oil can last, even a semi syntactic, but how about the oil filter? These companies is very smart, they never mention anything on the oil filter, so when anything happend, they will deny is their fault.

 

[mengz]

yes, i too advice dun flush engine with those engine flush chemical if u own the car from brand new and take good care of it. but sometimes for ppl who bought 2nd hand car, like me. we donno how the previous owner take care of the car, and my engine is having some minor leak somewhere that cannot detect. so its good to flush the engine to see where is teh actualy leak. y ppl say flush engine not good is bcoz, it removes the sludge that sometimes seals the leak. so when u flush the engine, the sludge is being removed, then u have like valve seal leak or piston leaks.

i mean, theres two ways u can look at it. one is at least u know where the actual leak is now and can fix it once and for all. the other way u can look at it is, shit!! after flushing my car is consuming engine oil(which might already be in the 1st place but sealed by the sludge), and have to spend money to fix it.

but if given the chance to own my car from brand new, i believe i won't have to do an engine flush.

 

[kyheng]

If the engine got no leak on bottom, then got 2 things that might cause oil leak, which is the drain nut and oil filter as this 2 is always opened during an oil change. If can try look for the service shop that using eductor to educt the oil from the place we check for level..

 

[mengz]

waiks...bro, i highly dun recommend that way for removing engine oil. bcoz that way, u wun drain out the dirty engine oil fully. quite alot of the old engine oil will remain at the sump. my mech has this machine which he uses for other cars, makes job easier but on my car he doesnt use it, i dun want him to either :P drain from oil sump nut the best ler.

but usually if leak at drain nut and oil filter, u can see oil stains on the floor.

 

[kyheng]

The point for checking the oil level is 1 of the lowest point of the sump beside oil filter, so he will normally educt out all first. Is still the same, only the new way it will be more cleaner and the mech will exposed to less oil compare to old method. Another thing is, if drain at bottom some people might damage the drain nut.
Some mech will jack up your car abit before they educt the oil out. It still depends on how we see it, for me, as long as they all the old oil can be drain/educt out, that's the most important part.

 

[plugtop]

yup thats true.....try n go check all ur gasket and oil seal......maybe there s leaking......such head gasket, timing belt oil seal, ail sum gasket,
distributor iol ring, rocker cover gasket n etc....if no leaking...maybe u should go for detail checking.....