Pros and cons of engine braking?

RENESIS VIII

7,000 RPM
Senior Member
Jun 13, 2012
7,063
950
1,713
Ipoh
Is there any specific harm to the car if engine braking is occasionally applied? Like will the transmission, clutch or anything else be prone to damage?

I drive a manual transmission car and I tend to use engine braking a lot to slow down my car instead of using the brakes. Some people come and tell me that what I am doing will eventually harm my transmission.

So, what are the thoughts and opinions from you all regarding engine braking?
 

Attachments

Tom

TIMETOATTACK
Helmet Clan
Jul 6, 2000
5,562
3,229
5,213
Kuala Lumpur
Is there any specific harm to the car if engine braking is occasionally applied? Like will the transmission, clutch or anything else be prone to damage?

I drive a manual transmission car and I tend to use engine braking a lot to slow down my car instead of using the brakes. Some people come and tell me that what I am doing will eventually harm my transmission.

So, what are the thoughts and opinions from you all regarding engine braking?
It really depends how you use it to be honest but manual transmissions hardly break in road cars.
As long the transitions between gears are smooth, clutch is applied properly I don't see why there is a need to worry. There is engine braking even in today's modern dual clutch transmission.

You should of course always use the brakes as the priority. For example, to stop before a toll plaza coming in at over 100km/h on engine braking is simply not wise.

Having said that, to conserve clutch and transmission wear some quarters in racing adamantly discourages any engine braking at all, especially in endurance and rely 100% on the brakes alone.
 

vr2turbo

Beyond 20,000 RPM!
Helmet Clan
Moderator
May 11, 2010
29,998
8,385
1,713
Petaling Jaya
I use engine brake all the time, but if slow speed then use brakes only, if very fast, will be brakes first to slow down then engine brake to slow further before harder braking. In a way drop gear to engine brakes especially coming to corners then no need shift to accelerate out.....lol
 

RENESIS VIII

7,000 RPM
Senior Member
Thread starter
Jun 13, 2012
7,063
950
1,713
Ipoh
It really depends how you use it to be honest but manual transmissions hardly break in road cars.
As long the transitions between gears are smooth, clutch is applied properly I don't see why there is a need to worry. There is engine braking even in today's modern dual clutch transmission.

You should of course always use the brakes as the priority. For example, to stop before a toll plaza coming in at over 100km/h on engine braking is simply not wise.

Having said that, to conserve clutch and transmission wear some quarters in racing adamantly discourages any engine braking at all, especially in endurance and rely 100% on the brakes alone.
I do use it occasionally. I tend to look far ahead to see whether do I need to stop or slow down my car. If I need, I will normally start to downshift from as far as 50 metres away from the targeted point and I'll use the brakes when I'm quite near the target point.

Like what Tom said - no issues but don't go and downshift 5 to 1 or 2 la.
I din't let the revs to go over the red line but once in a while, I might let it go until around 5000rpm which I am not so sure is that fine or not.

I use engine brake all the time, but if slow speed then use brakes only, if very fast, will be brakes first to slow down then engine brake to slow further before harder braking. In a way drop gear to engine brakes especially coming to corners then no need shift to accelerate out.....lol
I downshift at corners too when I am going fast. Normally at higher speeds, I'll try to corner at a higher rpm lets say like around 3500 rpm and above because I feel that it is easier to slow down in case I need it. At high rpm, the speed will drop faster after I release the throttle compared to lower rpm. At least this allows me to slow down the car in a faster way before I start to apply braking.
 

6UE5t

6,000 RPM
Senior Member
Oct 8, 2010
6,756
1,300
1,713
Kuala Lumpur
I do use it occasionally. I tend to look far ahead to see whether do I need to stop or slow down my car. If I need, I will normally start to downshift from as far as 50 metres away from the targeted point and I'll use the brakes when I'm quite near the target point.



I din't let the revs to go over the red line but once in a while, I might let it go until around 5000rpm which I am not so sure is that fine or not.



I downshift at corners too when I am going fast. Normally at higher speeds, I'll try to corner at a higher rpm lets say like around 3500 rpm and above because I feel that it is easier to slow down in case I need it. At high rpm, the speed will drop faster after I release the throttle compared to lower rpm. At least this allows me to slow down the car in a faster way before I start to apply braking.
Hmm you mean you downshift first before you brake? You should do it the other way around which is brake first then downshift. If you downshift first, that puts more stress on the gearbox and engine, and you risk locking up the tires especially when driving fast and you're already at high engine rpms. If you brake first then the transition between accelerating and slowing down would be smoother (less chance of lock ups), then it also allows the rpm to decrease to acceptable & optimal level first before you downshift hence minimizing the transmission stress. That's why there's the heel & toe technique where you brake first with the top of your foot (supposedly the toe area) then blip the gas with your side foot (supposedly the heel) to rev match for downshifting.
 

Tom

TIMETOATTACK
Helmet Clan
Jul 6, 2000
5,562
3,229
5,213
Kuala Lumpur
Hmm you mean you downshift first before you brake? You should do it the other way around which is brake first then downshift. If you downshift first, that puts more stress on the gearbox and engine, and you risk locking up the tires especially when driving fast and you're already at high engine rpms. If you brake first then the transition between accelerating and slowing down would be smoother (less chance of lock ups), then it also allows the rpm to decrease to acceptable & optimal level first before you downshift hence minimizing the transmission stress. That's why there's the heel & toe technique where you brake first with the top of your foot (supposedly the toe area) then blip the gas with your side foot (supposedly the heel) to rev match for downshifting.
It is okay to downshift a gear or maybe 2 before braking, just to shave some speed. Fully depends on situation of course.

for example:
- Approaching the toll plaza say 500m away from 6th to 5th or 5th to 4th before applying the brakes
- Approaching a slower car on the fast lane
- To anticipate an overtaking maneuver
 

Tom

TIMETOATTACK
Helmet Clan
Jul 6, 2000
5,562
3,229
5,213
Kuala Lumpur
How does this apply to non-DSG auto transmission with tiptronic?? Is it ok to engine brake?
All transmissions are designed to take these basic situations.

Like descending a hill on a lower gear or ferrying a car load of people and cargo.

As long as the tiptronic system allows you to downshift, it should be safe enough for the said engine speed.
 

KenDiriwan

1,000 RPM
Senior Member
Mar 15, 2006
1,283
225
3,163
kendiriwan.multiply.com
I use this method daily, basically bumps, traffic light, round about as long as there are need to slow down. Not sure about the rest but i am those take especially bumps with care preferred not to roll it over naturally even on low speed.
 

6UE5t

6,000 RPM
Senior Member
Oct 8, 2010
6,756
1,300
1,713
Kuala Lumpur
It is okay to downshift a gear or maybe 2 before braking, just to shave some speed. Fully depends on situation of course.

for example:
- Approaching the toll plaza say 500m away from 6th to 5th or 5th to 4th before applying the brakes
- Approaching a slower car on the fast lane
- To anticipate an overtaking maneuver
Yes, of course in normal cruising speed ad relatively low rpm still ok to downshift first but reading his story above it seems like he's also on a fast, high rpm mode while doing that.

Anyway for me personally, even when normal/cruising drive, most of the time I still brake first. The only rare occasions where I may downshift first are:
- the 3rd case in your list above while I'm already in too high gear (say already in 6th but only at 100kph, then I drop it to 4th or 3rd to overtake fast or to distance a tailgater behind), or
- I was driving like a hooligan to lock the rear to slide when still teenager back then!
 

marv3

Known Member
Jun 5, 2014
496
57
528
Kuala Lumpur
I also usually brake first then downshift and i will balance the amount of pressure on brake pedal with the engine braking :driver::driver:
 

RENESIS VIII

7,000 RPM
Senior Member
Thread starter
Jun 13, 2012
7,063
950
1,713
Ipoh
Hmm you mean you downshift first before you brake? You should do it the other way around which is brake first then downshift. If you downshift first, that puts more stress on the gearbox and engine, and you risk locking up the tires especially when driving fast and you're already at high engine rpms. If you brake first then the transition between accelerating and slowing down would be smoother (less chance of lock ups), then it also allows the rpm to decrease to acceptable & optimal level first before you downshift hence minimizing the transmission stress. That's why there's the heel & toe technique where you brake first with the top of your foot (supposedly the toe area) then blip the gas with your side foot (supposedly the heel) to rev match for downshifting.
Yes, I downshift before I brake but not at high engine rpms. If I am at 3500 to 4000rpm and above, I don't downshift.

It is okay to downshift a gear or maybe 2 before braking, just to shave some speed. Fully depends on situation of course.

for example:
- Approaching the toll plaza say 500m away from 6th to 5th or 5th to 4th before applying the brakes
- Approaching a slower car on the fast lane
- To anticipate an overtaking maneuver
You are exactly right on the examples that you gave. Those are the kind of situations where I normally downshift to slow down the car.
 

6UE5t

6,000 RPM
Senior Member
Oct 8, 2010
6,756
1,300
1,713
Kuala Lumpur
Yes, I downshift before I brake but not at high engine rpms. If I am at 3500 to 4000rpm and above, I don't downshift.



You are exactly right on the examples that you gave. Those are the kind of situations where I normally downshift to slow down the car.
Well for me even in those circumstances most of the time I still brake first at least a little. Anyway it's up to you if you prefer to downshift first. If you're just concerned whether that will break your car, then at low rpms should still be ok but if you're driving fast in higher rpms then you should brake first.
 

^pomen_GTR^

7,000 RPM
Senior Member
May 13, 2010
7,509
1,690
1,713
The Mines
just one...during high performance driving...engine braking with over-rev will destroy the engine...

other than that there is no problem at all
 

Random Post Every 5 Minutes

We at MPd Auto Center Sdn Bhd, are proud to have sponsored ZeE with TiTAN custom built performance shock absorbers, who finished 2nd overall in the SSO 2.5 Drift Challenge in One Utama!

CONGRATULATIONS ZeE!

The calm before the storm :D
(left to right) MrNismo, Geralyn(ZeE's new fan! :D) Adrian and ZeE!


Remember to support this car ya! :D...
Ask a question, start a discussion or post something for sale!
Post thread

Online now

Enjoying Zerotohundred?

Log-in for an ad-less experience