need gd opinion on water injection.

legend7

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legend7

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Water injection decreases the possibility of detonation by lowering the combustion chamber temperatures and increasing the effective "octane" of the fuel. This allows the engine to run a higher boost and full spark advance without the use of race gas. Additionally, if the water is atomized in the intake stream, there is an additional cooling of the intake charge. Both effects are increased with the inclusion of 50% alcohol to the mix (don't spray the exterior of an intercooler with alcoho!, this refers to internal injection only). The additional fuel of the high octane alcohol will in turn allow boost beyond what the factory fuel system can deliver. Water injection also has the effect of "steam cleaning" the combustion chambers and exhaust valves. This removes the carbon build up that decreases efficiency and leads to pre-ignition(detonation). It will also keep the throttle body and interior of the intake manifold much cleaner than normal.ive read this article on the net. already had the diagram & all stuff ready, but before i work on this project i wanna ask opinion from sifu's... is there any disavantage of water injection? ive done the extractor wrap last week & wonder, if it will clash on eachother since the extractor wrap is to keep heat in the extractor guess the heat will also keept in the cylinder & the water injection will cool it down.. hehehhe really confius with this..
 

legend7

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errr. sorry bro, cant view the attachment. would u mind e-mail it to me?
 

Raja_Mongkut

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Raja_Mongkut

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Water injection decreases the possibility of detonation by lowering the combustion chamber temperatures and increasing the effective "octane" of the fuel. This allows the engine to run a higher boost and full spark advance without the use of race gas. Additionally, if the water is atomized in the intake stream, there is an additional cooling of the intake charge. Both effects are increased with the inclusion of 50% alcohol to the mix (don't spray the exterior of an intercooler with alcoho!, this refers to internal injection only). The additional fuel of the high octane alcohol will in turn allow boost beyond what the factory fuel system can deliver. Water injection also has the effect of "steam cleaning" the combustion chambers and exhaust valves. This removes the carbon build up that decreases efficiency and leads to pre-ignition(detonation). It will also keep the throttle body and interior of the intake manifold much cleaner than normal.ive read this article on the net. already had the diagram & all stuff ready, but before i work on this project i wanna ask opinion from sifu's... is there any disavantage of water injection? ive done the extractor wrap last week & wonder, if it will clash on eachother since the extractor wrap is to keep heat in the extractor guess the heat will also keept in the cylinder & the water injection will cool it down.. hehehhe really confius with this..
thermal wrapping the extractor only affects the exhaust manifold... coz u want that area as hot as possible... i dunno the techy side but hot air moves faster than cold air...

water injection cools the intake manifold.. so its 2 different things
 

legend7

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wow !! nice diagram, yah its looks more like that, by the way what is the function of thermal valve??
 

burnner

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burnner

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sky....
using water injection only for turbo/supercharge engine. How about our Standard ENgine, will it give more power...cause as what I know NA engine runs cooler than turbo/supercharge engine. Please help to explain...thanks..
 

SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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not vr sure... i also learn from other taikor taikor... still experimenting with it... i'm using pure tap water only... no alcohol mixed into it...

that valve is to control the amount of moisture being sucked into the manifold/TB.... thats what i'm experiementing, the best amount of moist so my car wont run lean in AFR mixture and jerk or too little to give any improvement...

i heard that by injecting fine water mist into TB, it can cools ur engine running temperature, increase compression a little bit (bcoz water is denser than air), thus a little more power n torque can be produced.... but too much moist flowing into ur combustion leans out the AFR mixture and might even have bigger problems in future....

correct me if wrong... any more sifoo wanna add their info and experience??...
 

amrancharger

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amrancharger

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skywalker,
mind sharing wif me on how to build this water injection.pls use simple english ya...me no basic in technical stuff.er..can u also list the items u use to build yr water injection and where u buy it.i still dun understand lor..even after reading da links u provide...about how to diy this thingy... ;)
 

SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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skywalker,
mind sharing wif me on how to build this water injection.pls use simple english ya...me no basic in technical stuff.er..can u also list the items u use to build yr water injection and where u buy it.i still dun understand lor..even after reading da links u provide...about how to diy this thingy... ;)
erm... explain in words vr hard ler... u need to first understand the basic understanding how this stuff works....

anyway, things u need:
- good quality water bottle
- aquarium hose / vacuum hose
- breather
- T-connector

first, build the bottle like this...


another sample...


after that, find any vacuum hose that is connected to ur intake manifold... if u driving proton with standard carburettor, tap to this hose...
 

riz2005

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riz2005

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from the diagram its look like suck cool air from the bottle.. not water...
as i know, we want to suck the water flow into the intake manifold.
 

SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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it is sucking moist from the bottle... not jz air...
u need a mist spray mounted at the manifold if u want it to suck water directly...

this is not a perfect diy as water is not injected as fine mist into the TB... thats why instead of sucking water directly, we suck moist in the bottle...
 

SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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if EFI i guess u need a water pump, which gonna cost abit more... coz fuel injected engines dont have vacuum pressure inside the manifold rite??... correct me if wrong... coz previously ftzone do sell such water injection system... his package for EFi engines includes a water pump......
 

Kendconcerto

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the idea is to get cool densed air.....just like raining effect
 

Kendconcerto

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haaaar ? u dono meh ?

FORM 3 Science wor..........
 

Kendconcerto

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Kendconcerto

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Why o ? u wanna know ar ? why wanna know ?
 

SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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lolz... its the low temperature that make the air cool... and the rain that make the temperature lower....

explain also explain la baik baik... later kena shoot again i laugh till die lor....
 

ylkien

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ylkien

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nice product here skywalker.

About the cool air and rain...here is the details

- When temperature is LOW, atoms move slowly (imagine 100km/h, something like solid material). This means they are closer together.
- When temperature is HIGH, atoms get more energy, and therefore, it bounces back and forth (imagine 500km/h, between other atom) faster, which makes it spaced further apart (something like water)

So, taking the examples above (solid vs water), solid is much denser than water, which means it is more pack (dense).

Conclusion : Cooler air is denser. Driving at night or in the rain, actually helps the engine to 'breath' better, and should improve FC.
 
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SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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but what i experienced from it, water injection theory is not applied like this... the water doesnt cools down the intake air.... instead, the main benefit of it is to increase compression a little bit because water is denser than air.... thats why u need to spray fine mist into ur combustion chamber, and not put a drop of water inside...
 

Kendconcerto

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ur car dyno how much bhp improvement ?
 

Kendconcerto

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ur car dyno how much bhp improvement ?
 

SkYwAlKeR

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SkYwAlKeR

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100bhp... muahahaha...
little bit also wanna dyno, so free arr??....

wait i buy new car... den dyno... if the bhp figure not up to what its written in the brochure, i go sue that company for millions....
 
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erm... explain in words vr hard ler... u need to first understand the basic understanding how this stuff works....

after that, find any vacuum hose that is connected to ur intake manifold... if u driving proton with standard carburettor, tap to this hose...
i got ur point bro.. nice ~~ :regular_smile: :congrats:

but.. need sum favor bro...

where is the vacumm hose for kancil 850 stock??...

is it applicable to kancil engine too??

hehe.. thanx u very d mush..