Public Apology

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Acoustic

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Originally posted by Starlite@Jul 23 2004, 11:43 PM
if u guys haf the damn prove to prove that all those are imitation and that ur words are "correct", then y not i suggest u go ahead and take action?? instead u ppl are just playing around with words and debating whose products are imitation. if u dare to call urself "guys" then compete the right and ethical way, not stabbing anyone's back without their knowledge. i'm actually shocked to see this scenario happening even between guys.
well he is right also ..................... oooppppppssssssssss sorry Stanley - I can see stones coming from Bandar Utama already ......... :) hehehehh
 

Acoustic

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Originally posted by Starlite@Jul 23 2004, 11:43 PM
but i seriously think that ppl nowadays are far more intelligent than u think. they wouldn't pay such a big sum of money without thinking. maybe u can say some problems arise with the absorbers u bought from there, but nothing is perfect in this world. i'm sure that some things u buy also has their defects but certainly not all. i'm sure if u take the initiative to go back and ask for ur abs to be serviced, who will be so stupid to just simply repair it for u and lose business prospect in the future? we're talking abt business here and of coz no 1 wants to imitate and get profit just for a certain time. we're talking abt long-term business if u know wat i mean. anyway, i'm talking abt justice and evidence. since some ppl are only interested in making up stories abt others without evidence, then y waste ur time reading my msg.
Sorry, I KNOW you are wrong.

Things like SUSPENSION - absorbers - although looked like very simple, known to work as simple devices - however is ONE of the world's most difficult engineering, because it has the most VARIABLES.

There are just not enough - and will never be enough - EDUCATED public who knows what is good and what is bad.

Hence they all will buy the wrong thing, why? because they are forced to use their last line of judgement / believe, which is whoever brand advertise WINS.

You know this very clear...... it's human psychology. Discovered by the very white people long ago...

advertisement, propaganda, man.............

So, the conclusion is people will still buy the wrong thing - always.



All the dealers are who? at the end of the day just another business men.

No offence - but I don't know many "ECTHICAL" business men. All so chin cai, got money come - don't care already.
 

fstr

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diu!!! bring titan abs and GAB abs to dyno at an independent shop from there see it at your own eyes.

sorry to say this but i am not a titan customer or a GAB customer but just someone on the fair side of things, if either one is an imitation then both of you deserve to sue each other of watever that u like to do, so be it.

wats a sales manager duty, to provide all critics that are wrong and that their products are safe and worthy to use by interested buyers who wans to install it in their car. and also to make sure your company is well protected from critics, and in this world of business there will be critics all over not only on suspensions or abs. and each has to face that critic in order to make their product more publicly aware.

and titan suspensions has every right to comment on your products whether to prove and compare. and GAB has every right to tell or do do the same.

So what da big fuss!!!! both of u are in this business tactic of "criticsm" not only by you EACH other but also by other abs manufacturer as well...just settle things with each other looking at one's own eyes. i believe both of you has D advantage of each other in terms of product and know-how.

hey if u wanna talk to me pls do so.

wat for fighting each other? either way its not good for ur business, if u wanna flame or hentam each other go to a flaming section in general.

this is business, wats business without competitiveness??


cheers!! B)
 

Acoustic

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Originally posted by (XO)@Jul 24 2004, 12:24 AM
Dear customers, i'm one of the sales manager from RS1. Actually what does ninja know abt our product? All of our products are highly tested by dyno machine which is imported from japan.
XO,

I'm very glad that someone from some other brand come up and talk about this.

I'm talking using the attitude of a "consumer" and talking to "A LOCAL ENTERPRENEUR" Man I should support you man, because I bloody hate foreign brands.



Disclaimer - Words from my heart, some sound like scolding / complaing. But please read it in the crying manner, because I'm really sad for Malaysians for this.


The HWL brand, not so good lah interms of product as well as image. Well bad image in this forum anyway. Why?

Not I taruh you, but your customer complain you know.


Man, I went to Top Perfect in Sg Buloh, Talked to Mr Wong, and wanted to buy the MT4 RM2.8k

I ask a quotation from him, specifying what I'm being sold, what's the warranty period, and most importantly must print the "service until you satisfied" - because that's that he says from his mouth.

You know what happen ar?

He walked away and don't want to talk to me.

At 1st I though he go do something, I stupid stupid give face wait until half an hour - he still walk here walk there do nothing, then I ask him why? He said no lah, scared of customer like me lah.

BTW did you read the complain from the putra club MSN message board. Again not from us you know.



Then the very friend whom recommend me to top perfect. over 3 years already top perfect still cannot solve his problem.

That idiot until today still so stupid want to believe top perfect, everytime go kena charge this charge that, but after change something ask me test his car then complain this complain that.

You ask me how to believe the RS1 or MINES or whatever HWL version outside, but inside our own...... how you expect people to believe you?





Some more my other friend, wira sedan, less than 6 months absorber completely lost strength, take back puchong dealer claim warranty - say no service. At the end have to sell off as 2nd-hand.

Before that, every weekend I'll go to his house try to setup different setting for him, always CAN do this, but cannot do that.

From what I see, the FUNDAMENTALS is not right you know, the method you all use. I.E. you all didn't match the coil to the absorber stroke to the car's height to the absorber's mounting seating height and finally to the coil's seat height. ALL salah.






I don't want to say much. You are after all local manufacturer, I should support you. But local or not, you have to earn it, not chin cai quality man.

BTW I'm a engineer, I don't believe ISO standard, because all professionals know it's a stupid thing.

Everyone knows with ISO, doesn't mean it's good.







Then please lah, do your own R&D. AND I WARN YOU, DON"T TELL ME YOU DID - because I BLOODY know you don't know what is

ma+kx+c=0



I know TiTAN don't know this also..... but they got lucky with me, their black magic method / formula / solution manages to cheat me until today.



To the other manufacturers. You all say you all so pretigous, so big and all BUT not one real engineer in the R&D department.

Don't have website also............

No technical support page ..............



except for APM and KYB lah.





Oh yeah, our local university got buy very high-end, very expensive acoustical measurement equipement, latest and all..

And the end how? NO ONE KNOWS HOW TO USE.

Finally how? have to ask me to go.

You think you got absorber dyno - I'm going to trust you meh.

XXX also got dyno lah, you see any great works from there? salah tune got allot lah.



If you want to see how I support local industry, see my website.
 

CcL

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bravo acoustic...
respector!!!
how do i calculate spring rate ark?!?
battousai tell me formulas until i blur...
sumthin about curb weight, max cornering G, etc etc etc <_<
 

Joeker

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I dunno much about suspension, handling and all that jazz.

But I do know tat in BASIC business ethics, u do not step down on other people's product in order to promote your own product.

You may say that your product has so and so benefits/advantages than the othe products in the market but NEVER step down on other peoples product, NEVER!!

I think someone needs more breast feeding from his mama.
 

Acoustic

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Originally posted by fstrader@Jul 24 2004, 01:29 AM
diu!!! bring titan abs and GAB abs to dyno at an independent shop from there see it at your own eyes.
You're right

But to test longevity takes very long time wor..... dunno they got such patience or not.

Then, the issue of ride quality, performance handling and all, how to see.

I've only seen simple graphs, which doesn't tell anything.

Then there is this type which tells allot, but doesn't seem to be anyone how knows how to translate it: -



From http://www.my-acoustic.com/Car/Suspension/suspension3.htm




But hor I want to say - graphs like these are extremely difficult to describe, because they are in TIME Domain, and humans are worst in TIME Domain.

That's what 1st instrument invented and tells of reading to humans.

However due to last time's engineers / researchers are better in fundamentals hence they make another machine to convert the TIME signal into the frequency signal, hence today allot of device display in FREQUENCY Domain. Like Audio.

However Frequency response curve are also extremely difficult to understand. I took over 10 years to fully understand them. That's also because I was lucky enough to be involved in some measurement works, over 10,000 acoustical measurements was carried out over all possible conditions, looking, listening test, changing a known parameter, retest, relisten and all.

We also had to go into questioning of the measurement's equipment nature of technology, method of acquisition and all to finally come into the stage.

I can honestly tell you, not many people knows how to translate audio frequency response. Seriously.

Then if we talk about audio in it's original form, which is in TIME Domain and if we display the graph in TIME instead of FREQUENCY, even I cannot translate it.

Human brains are just not meant to look through signals using the eyes.

So, absorbers device are operating in the TIME Domain and hence the primary result is also TIME Domain, hence I think no one will be able o describe their characters properly....

Unless..... this guy sold his soul to the absorber devil, like I sold my soul to the audio devil :) hahaahah

No lah, seriously, to describe TIME Domain world by humans accurately, IMPOSSIBLE.
 

fstr

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hehheheeh acoustic i know u are engineer lar...me know nuts about graphs or numbers mar :P but i know something about biz lar...lol :rolleyes:
 

Acoustic

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Originally posted by CcL@Jul 24 2004, 02:07 AM
bravo acoustic...
respector!!!
how do i calculate spring rate ark?!?
battousai tell me formulas until i blur...
sumthin about curb weight, max cornering G, etc etc etc <_<
that one ar, either PM me or you open a new post, I reply there lor, but I no suspension sifu. Only try my best.
 

toyota03

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Originally posted by Joeker@Jul 24 2004, 02:12 AM
I dunno much about suspension, handling and all that jazz.

But I do know tat in BASIC business ethics, u do not step down on other people's product in order to promote your own product.

You may say that your product has so and so benefits/advantages than the othe products in the market but NEVER step down on other peoples product, NEVER!!

I think someone needs more breast feeding from his mama.
TOTALLY KOREK.....


I second this statement. ""But I do know tat in BASIC business ethics, u do not step down on other people's product in order to promote your own product.

You may say that your product has so and so benefits/advantages than the othe products in the market but NEVER step down on other peoples product, NEVER!!""

Unless we are consumer and we give LINGAM OPINIOn or LINGAM comment lorr..


:) :)
 

toyota03

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Originally posted by Acoustic+Jul 24 2004, 02:17 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Acoustic @ Jul 24 2004, 02:17 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-fstrader@Jul 24 2004, 01:29 AM
diu!!! bring titan abs and GAB abs to dyno at an independent shop from there see it at your own eyes.
You're right

But to test longevity takes very long time wor..... dunno they got such patience or not.

Then, the issue of ride quality, performance handling and all, how to see.

I've only seen simple graphs, which doesn't tell anything.

Then there is this type which tells allot, but doesn't seem to be anyone how knows how to translate it: -



From http://www.my-acoustic.com/Car/Suspension/suspension3.htm




But hor I want to say - graphs like these are extremely difficult to describe, because they are in TIME Domain, and humans are worst in TIME Domain.

That's what 1st instrument invented and tells of reading to humans.

However due to last time's engineers / researchers are better in fundamentals hence they make another machine to convert the TIME signal into the frequency signal, hence today allot of device display in FREQUENCY Domain. Like Audio.

However Frequency response curve are also extremely difficult to understand. I took over 10 years to fully understand them. That's also because I was lucky enough to be involved in some measurement works, over 10,000 acoustical measurements was carried out over all possible conditions, looking, listening test, changing a known parameter, retest, relisten and all.

We also had to go into questioning of the measurement's equipment nature of technology, method of acquisition and all to finally come into the stage.

I can honestly tell you, not many people knows how to translate audio frequency response. Seriously.

Then if we talk about audio in it's original form, which is in TIME Domain and if we display the graph in TIME instead of FREQUENCY, even I cannot translate it.

Human brains are just not meant to look through signals using the eyes.

So, absorbers device are operating in the TIME Domain and hence the primary result is also TIME Domain, hence I think no one will be able o describe their characters properly....

Unless..... this guy sold his soul to the absorber devil, like I sold my soul to the audio devil :) hahaahah

No lah, seriously, to describe TIME Domain world by humans accurately, IMPOSSIBLE. [/b][/quote]
Wahhh Sifu Chin,


Time Domain again meh???

kkekekekekekekekekekkekekekekekeke


Can explain More detail about Time Domain ar???


:P
 

Danny

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it's good to see more than 1 suspension co. rep here but I feel that whenever there is statement by any so called representative & counter arguments, make sure it is supported by facts & actual evidence. Otherwise it is either hearsay or bullshit.

Some people find that Stanley's criticism of other brands are a bit tackless and maybe lack some professionalism, but if it is true, he has every right to say what he wants, be it tackless or not. If not, then he's in a lot of trouble with a very likely defamation suit. If Stanley is right, we are indeed thankful that an imitation brand is exposed.

XO & Starlite, since you have joined this forum, it is the greatest opportunity for you guys to clear our doubts. If you are really selling/manufacturing original GAB absorbers, just ask GAB to issue you an authorised agent letter and the terms an condition of the agency to sell/produce GAB absorbers. That will certainly end all doubts. You may ask, why do you need to proove this to zth forumers? The answer is obvious, you are using a much respected absorber co. ie. GAB as your own. In comparison, it is similar to a local factory producing or assembling a car called Mercedes. The company must have the rights from the parent company to do so. Otherwise, they can't sell the cars as Mercedes or they would have breached copyright laws.
 

rsctan

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aiyah..all of this started with eg`s complaint of rs one..
well personally i nv been there...but come to think of it if you say that their service is not good blaf blaf blaf...well if you bought the abs from other shops they will most probably say that they`ll need a few days to check the abs then only fix rite? this cant be done in a few minutes one marr...
i fix my abs and my car was jacked up almost for a month just to fix the abs...

bout the imitation thig i dont really know lar..but no matter who is right or wrong...we should just keep the opinion up to us...no use flaming it one the net and make it a big hassle...u got an opinion keep it to your self..others might not think that way.. <_< <_<
 

Starlite

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just to clarify things, i'm not selling/manufacturing gab and i'm not someone from rs1. just expressing my opinion that ninja didn not use the right way.

i'm a business graduate, and yea, the basic ethic in business is we never ever talk bad abt our competitors' product in order to increase sales.

anyway, let's juz keep our opinion to ourselves and not start any flame here.
 
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