Involuntarily volunteered experiment

Izso

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Noted and i agree with your statement. That is why i have mentioned it's about the cost of production and whether car manufacturers are willing to invest in R&D for thousands if not millions in a technology that will only have little gain in performance needless to say better FC.

I appreciate your opinion.:top:
I appreciate nice blokes like you who are always open for a healthy debate minus the heated element. :top:

I'd like to issue you a challenge though - take out that air charger and let your car re-adapt and see if you're able to notice any difference.
 

ijnek

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hey izso, ran any test on VS?

i changed my ride recently and initially had no VS...
after i installed back my VS, acceleration seems smoother and overall ride seems smoother...jus not as smooth as my ex-car with CVT....

mayb it's jus me ...a matter of gettin used to the new car
 

keegs

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Oct 15, 2010
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I appreciate nice blokes like you who are always open for a healthy debate minus the heated element. :top:

I'd like to issue you a challenge though - take out that air charger and let your car re-adapt and see if you're able to notice any difference.
Thanks.
I've done it before for a day and not to spew on any misconception of the 'device', but I noticed a drop in my low end RPM. Maybe I can test it out for a few days to see how my car performs without it or maybe it could be a placebo affect.

The purpose of me installing this 'device' is to try whether it will really improve my overall performance. So far, it did a bit, FC no change for the past 3 weeks.

But I do have a friend (Waja 1.6 SOHC) that installed an Air Charger secretly and managed to beat me (Waja CPS) in a 400M drag by 1 car length and the cherry on the cake, he has never beaten me before.:hmmmm: This was all before I ever installed an air charger. It was only after I installed mine than I could match my friends car.

Bare in mind that our car's engine setup at Before & After are the same and a total of 3 Laps were tested to get any doubts out of the way (before my clutch over-heats):tongue:

Anyway, my case would be a bit subjective unless I can find some proper way or scientific evidence to show any improvements.:biggrin:
 

Izso

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hey izso, ran any test on VS?

i changed my ride recently and initially had no VS...
after i installed back my VS, acceleration seems smoother and overall ride seems smoother...jus not as smooth as my ex-car with CVT....

mayb it's jus me ...a matter of gettin used to the new car
I just got the green light from Tom to do this experiment idea :biggrin:

The thing about VS is it really depends on the platform. Different cars seem to have different responses. I'm suspecting the more the electronics, the more it is affected? I dunno. My Wira had a big response with the grounding kit but my Myvi had zero use for it. But the VS had big effect on Myvi. In fact my next test will be on VS right after my brake and coolant swap DIYs.

Thanks.
I've done it before for a day and not to spew on any misconception of the 'device', but I noticed a drop in my low end RPM. Maybe I can test it out for a few days to see how my car performs without it or maybe it could be a placebo affect.

The purpose of me installing this 'device' is to try whether it will really improve my overall performance. So far, it did a bit, FC no change for the past 3 weeks.

But I do have a friend (Waja 1.6 SOHC) that installed an Air Charger secretly and managed to beat me (Waja CPS) in a 400M drag by 1 car length and the cherry on the cake, he has never beaten me before.:hmmmm: This was all before I ever installed an air charger. It was only after I installed mine than I could match my friends car.

Bare in mind that our car's engine setup at Before & After are the same and a total of 3 Laps were tested to get any doubts out of the way (before my clutch over-heats):tongue:

Anyway, my case would be a bit subjective unless I can find some proper way or scientific evidence to show any improvements.:biggrin:
Interesting.. If you do take out the gadget dare I ask you to loan it to me for testing purposes?
 

keegs

Junior Member
Oct 15, 2010
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Miri/ Sarawak
I just got the green light from Tom to do this experiment idea :biggrin:

The thing about VS is it really depends on the platform. Different cars seem to have different responses. I'm suspecting the more the electronics, the more it is affected? I dunno. My Wira had a big response with the grounding kit but my Myvi had zero use for it. But the VS had big effect on Myvi. In fact my next test will be on VS right after my brake and coolant swap DIYs.



Interesting.. If you do take out the gadget dare I ask you to loan it to me for testing purposes?
I would loan you the gadget, but I will have to send it over to West M'sia as I'm living in Sarawak.:biggrin:
 

C99D-MMC5537

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those people who believe this kind of product might think that it will swirl the air until it reach combustion chamber.. and maybe will create an extra turbulent to better mix-up with fuel before it'll be ignite. i have 1 simple n quite DANGEROUS experiment for this kind of people. dismantle all your air box and its pipe (for NA only, charged engine cannot). let the mouth of throttle body directly suck air. start your engine. put your hand on the TB mouth (don't cover full, maybe half only. or your hand will be sucked into TB :biggrin: ). then, u'll get the idea how strong the vacuum produced by your engine (and this is in idling). then your common sense will tell u either this kind of product will work or not. it maybe only capable to swirl the air for few cm after it in straight line (which engine got straight intake line from air box to cylinder head?? 4AGE 4throttle maybe..). hehehe.. :biggrin:
 

D7zul

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compressed air is better than swirled air

go for velocity stack

:biggrin:

 

BetaProject

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i tot the air charger theory is nothing more that a "1 way valve" installed between air cleaner and throttle body... so your are by passing the air cleaner box hence defeating the purpose of air cleaner...
 

keegs

Junior Member
Oct 15, 2010
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Miri/ Sarawak
i tot the air charger theory is nothing more that a "1 way valve" installed between air cleaner and throttle body... so your are by passing the air cleaner box hence defeating the purpose of air cleaner...
Yes, an air charger is a 1 way valve but the proper place to install the air charger is at the vacuum lead hose from intake manifold (where you usually connect your vacuum meter with a T-junction hose).

The reason being is that an air charger supplies extra external source of vacuum to your existing vacuum pressure rather than getting it all from your air filter.
Logically, it will supply you with the vacuum needed to your system when under full throttle (at idle, you won't see any difference). If you have a Vacuum Meter you can tell the difference as it can help in maintaining a stable vacuum pressure under load given that you adjust the air charger valve appropriately.

For example, I installed my air charger in between the intake manifold and the FPR. Resulting in better fuel pressure stability at high revs and full load. (It is for my testing purposes only and does not apply to all engines.:biggrin:)

On another note, I'm not supporting the fact that an air charger is a good or a bad gadget. All of this is done in the name of testing and researching on whether it works or not. After all, we all want to save a few bucks on fuel here and there right?:driver:
 

BetaProject

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Yes, an air charger is a 1 way valve but the proper place to install the air charger is at the vacuum lead hose from intake manifold (where you usually connect your vacuum meter with a T-junction hose).

The reason being is that an air charger supplies extra external source of vacuum to your existing vacuum pressure rather than getting it all from your air filter.
Logically, it will supply you with the vacuum needed to your system when under full throttle (at idle, you won't see any difference). If you have a Vacuum Meter you can tell the difference as it can help in maintaining a stable vacuum pressure under load given that you adjust the air charger valve appropriately.

For example, I installed my air charger in between the intake manifold and the FPR. Resulting in better fuel pressure stability at high revs and full load. (It is for my testing purposes only and does not apply to all engines.:biggrin:)

On another note, I'm not supporting the fact that an air charger is a good or a bad gadget. All of this is done in the name of testing and researching on whether it works or not. After all, we all want to save a few bucks on fuel here and there right?:driver:
i see, will research more on the "science" behind it...btw, u from Miri? always saw your car "racing" down to lutong in the morning
 

keegs

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i see, will research more on the "science" behind it...btw, u from Miri? always saw your car "racing" down to lutong in the morning
Cool.
Yes, I'm from Miri..hahaha :proud:. I work in Senadin, that's why I always "rush" down to Lutong side.:tongue:.
Have we met before?:hmmmm2:
 

skazareth

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They say, it's a Conspiracy Theory wor... LOL!
finally this guy came up with what playing in my head....

my final year supervisor came up with the idea of sustainable energy using magnet for my topic years back in uni days. He answered to my question when i asked why this brilliant idea did not goes for mass production especially for automobile, he said, "Got a group so-called '7 Sisters' against the idea of this sustainable energy 30 years ago. This group made a covenant of not spoiling each other's business and against all good ideas that would affect them."

I asked again, who was that 7 Sisters. Like Gandalf, he answered...

"U feed your car with their product on daily basis... that's one of them..."

And he left like Horatio in CSI. Damn he got style... :adore:
 

BetaProject

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Cool.
Yes, I'm from Miri..hahaha :proud:. I work in Senadin, that's why I always "rush" down to Lutong side.:tongue:.
Have we met before?:hmmmm2:
i see, all the way from riam or taman tunku? if so really far le ur work place, anyway, i think we never officially met, but got a few times we only "side by side" along the pujut lutong road:biggrin:, im always "rushing" to work too, i cant understand those ppl tht driving liek a turtle on a rush hour, so every morning when i saw ur car, i just follow behind, u open the road for me:biggrin:
 

Izso

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finally this guy came up with what playing in my head....

my final year supervisor came up with the idea of sustainable energy using magnet for my topic years back in uni days. He answered to my question when i asked why this brilliant idea did not goes for mass production especially for automobile, he said, "Got a group so-called '7 Sisters' against the idea of this sustainable energy 30 years ago. This group made a covenant of not spoiling each other's business and against all good ideas that would affect them."

I asked again, who was that 7 Sisters. Like Gandalf, he answered...

"U feed your car with their product on daily basis... that's one of them..."

And he left like Horatio in CSI. Damn he got style... :adore:
well, if you guys remember this japanese company that developed a car that ran on water - it did prove to be realistically possible but no one would invest in the project and the initial designs were flawed and had teething problems. And like you said - if the 7 sisters wanted to, they could have invested a fortune in developing and making it happen.

Exxonmobil's Rex Tillerson has on CNN declared that the companies path is not the reduction of usage of fossil fuels, but the optimisation of the processing and reducing wastage. He then gave the example of powering the US of A, they are now using 30% less fossil fuels as compared to 10 years ago because of this technology. But that's basically saying they'll never give up digging for oil. So unless you're a billionaire entrepreneur willing to spend on R&D (like what happened with Tesla cars), you'll never see the days of alternative energies in automotives or any industry.

Having said that though, the worlds largest oil & gas company Exxon isn't all evil. They spent millions on research for optimizing lithium film or something for batteries. The hybrids and electric cars of late are way more advanced than their predecessors because of this r&d. But who the hell cares about hybrids!!! Give me a fuel guzzling M3 anyday! :biggrin:

I would loan you the gadget, but I will have to send it over to West M'sia as I'm living in Sarawak.:biggrin:
Damn. Pity the gadget is so expensive to buy, otherwise I would've started my own mythbusters. Interesting explaination about the providing extra vacuum and all. A friend of mine experimented with a huge pipe and connected it to the vacuum like you did with the charger. Basically all it was, was a huge canister of nothing but air. It tremendously improved his braking response and according to him his throttle was crispier as well. But at the same time a similar car (but auto) tested it and found it did nothing for him. So it's very subjective. Ideally I'd like to test it without having to buy it to avoid any placebo effects since it's so bloody expensive to begin with.

Any volunteer donors?
 

keegs

Junior Member
Oct 15, 2010
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503
Miri/ Sarawak
i see, all the way from riam or taman tunku? if so really far le ur work place, anyway, i think we never officially met, but got a few times we only "side by side" along the pujut lutong road:biggrin:, im always "rushing" to work too, i cant understand those ppl tht driving liek a turtle on a rush hour, so every morning when i saw ur car, i just follow behind, u open the road for me:biggrin:
Yea, From Riam to Senadin (5 days a week) :rolleyes:. So next time when you're beside me, just give me a honk and we'll leave them 'turtles' behind in our rear view mirrors..haha!:biggrin:

Btw, might i ask what car you drive? May be give me a rough idea.:idea:
 

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