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Car & Driver Mag Claims BMW M3 To Be Better Than GT-R & 911 Turbo

K keshy
Posted onJun 4, 2008 at 2:11 AM

carscoop_bmw_m3_e92_0Well, it had to happen sometime, just as the saying goes, what goes up, must come down and the GT-R and 911 Turbo have surely enjoyed their time at the top but the problem is, they didn’t loose, the world beyond the glossy papers of Car & Driver will testify to that.
nissan_skyline_vs_porsche_911_turbo
But Car & Driver mag definitely did crown the BMW M3 King and I’m sure all of you have something to say about that. We didn’t get our hands on that particular issue of Car & Driver but they guys at AutoBlog did and this is what they had to say:

“Car & Driver is a common choice as bathroom reader around Autoblog HQ, though thumbing through the latest issue had us contemplating using the glossy pages for TP. C&D got its hands on Nissan’s new GT-R and its development benchmark, the Porsche 911 Turbo. That’s great so far, as everyone wants to know how the Nissan stacks up against its bogey. The trouble comes when a BMW M3 gets tossed into the mix. What? The M3 is a hell of a car and it clearly earns its perennial 10-Best status, but it’s outgunned and mismatched in this company. Somehow it managed to win a three-way comparo with two supercars anyway.

The explanation given was that the M3 attended as the “voice of reason” and gosh, just happened to be everyone’s favorite. It’s no great leap to imagine that the smallest, lightest car with sedan lineage would feel lighter on its feet and be a better everyday conveyance than two purpose built supercars. Thanks for the detective work, guys, but we think the M3 is a bit wide of the bullseye at which the GT-R and 911 were aimed. It’s long been grumbled that C&D is in cahoots with this automaker or that one (an accusation that’s been levied against every one of the big four major auto publications at one point or another), and the outcome of this comparo will surely fan those flames. We call foul on a few levels. The larger issue is the poppycock categories of “Fun to Drive” and the even more preposterous “Gotta Have It Factor” that arguably allow comparison results to be twisted one way or another, but also the reasoning for bringing the M3 knife to a big, turbocharged coupe gunfight is flawed. GT-R and 911 Turbo buyers don’t strike us as the type of folks who might cross shop the M3. They want a range-topper, not a segment-pole-sitter.

Here’s the real deal – ignoring the noise of the M3, the GT-R spanks the 911 Turbo on the track, while the Porsche feels like a more quality piece (at double the price, it’d better). While both cars sport AWD chassis that vector torque, the Nissan is quicker on its feet and dramaless where the Porsche is swinging wide. Both are a total hoot to drive, but the GT-R team definitely bested its development target as far as raw performance goes. Controversy will undoubtedly sell dead trees, though, and you can’t really blame an increasingly irrelevant buff book for trying to find a hook. Take pity – hit the link and share some traffic”.

Thats telling Car & Driver for you but just in case they didn’t get the point, make it loud and clear below.

Source: AutoBlog

Post Views: 541
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Bring all of em to the track...and let the cars do the talking
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    farique
  • Jun 4, 2008
I'd take the E92 M3 just for it's looks and versatility. But for pure performance hunger, I'd take the GTR instead.

Something is missing with the E92 M3. The power figures are somewhat similar to the E39 M5 except for the little heavyness of the M5.

it is un-fair judgement. M3, 911T and GTR. RWD competing with AWDs.
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    adam
  • Jun 4, 2008
ridiculous article by c&d! how can the roadgoing m3 be 'better' than 997 turbo n gtr..? NO WAY!! m3 was never intended to be in the same category as the two in the first place.. however, funnily, as much as autoblog (do they even get to test these cars?) claims that 'car & driver' wants to champion the propeller brand, did they not know that autocar themselves put up the m3 as comparisons in their tests too..?

meaning? either these mags really believe the rwd, NA, lower HP n torque m3 is really a great car and is a benchmark, respected and worthy to be compared with the obvious FI'd and 4wd monsters!! or they really need to bash the m3.. makes u wonder.. for me, i believe the former.. else, they cud easily use the much faster c63 or audi rs4 instead of the m3..

just to give us a different perspective, why not pit the gtr with the veyron? or the ultima GTR? or the 300hp ariel atom? i'm pretty sure the godzilla and the 997 turbo would get spanked left and right! people say the GTR is half the price of a 997 turbo, check this, the atom is only half the price of the GTR..!

oh, i get it, they are not even in the same class!! duhh.. heheh
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    zephyiuz
  • Jun 4, 2008
M3... i wouldnt call m3 low pwr... 4.0 running on 420hps.... that's like 100%+ pwr extraction. plus... GTR is 4wd fine... but it needs a turbo to push that car to 400+ps with a 3.8 engine.... btw forget about the porsche, their lazy design on cars is a real problem... on the track, its probably a M3 or gtr's taking the lead... btw if you tune a m3 right, with a supercharge 800+ horses would appear ... but u wouldnt necessary get 1000+ hps on the track, unless running on slicks
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    deacon
  • Jun 4, 2008
Car & Driver and Road & Track have both been guilty of having their pockets lined by manufacturers to garner winning reviews for their cars.

It's a tragedy, a tragedy indeed to even mention the paltry German patsy M3 in the same breath as the Godzilla and a 911. Ole Ferdinand Porsche would be spinning in his grave (I'd say the same for the father of Nissan but i'm not sure who that is).

Just in case if anyone needs proof of Road & Track having biased reviews for a particular car manufacturer, there is an issue way back in 1998 or was it 1997 where they compared a Acura Integra GSR with a Mitsubishi Eclipse GS-T and a brand spanking new Mercury Cougar. The Cougar won with it's superior interior space, despite losing in the handling and performance categories. Shameful.
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    deacon
  • Jun 4, 2008
zephyiuz,

Interesting take you have there. While a GTR has two turbochargers to create it's monstrous output, keep in mind the GTR will probably achieve better HP numbers in full tune and maintain reliability then compared with the M3, as it overly relies on an engine built to achieve Naturally Aspirated power - completely different by design to a turbo ready motor.

On track? Please the M3 wouldn't even come close.

Nurburgring times:

BMW M3 E92 - 8:05

Nissan GTR - 7:38

Porsche 911 - 7:40

I think you can honestly admit that while the 911 and GTR will be off to the races the M3 will be going backwards or so it would seem.

The E92 M3 is also slower than it's predecessor in CSL mode (Read: E46 M3 CSL 7:50)
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    adam
  • Jun 4, 2008
yup.. agree to all the above.. not much can be done on the m3 engine compared to turbocharged engine.. the juices all squeezed out from the double-VANOS unit already.. ehhee

just wish the e92 csl would be much, much better than the current m3.. cams, induction systems, exhaust, suspension, lower weight, brakes, DCT, etc..

e46 m3 - 8:22
e46 m3 csl - 7:50

e92 m3 - 8:05
e92 m3 csl - 7:35?? hehee, wishful thinking..

anyways, watch out for our own review of the GTR soon! :D
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    wongth7
  • Jun 4, 2008
its like comparing kancil with ferrari F1..haha
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    drM
  • Jun 4, 2008
we have had this problems for the past 30 years, and definitely it will keep going for the next 30 years.

for those who worship the GOdzilla, i believe u have been well sold by the GTR emblem and of course its grunt power. but the fact that matters is, GTR is a machine ONLY KNOWN by you. u have to be Godzilla fan to love one, and i dont chicks will be able to tell what car it is. they will definitely love more the 350Z which is nice. but yeah, in the end, its u that gonna drive it. to hell with the others.

the bimmer and posh are a class of their own. big brand and well known stature is all there to be seen. brand wise, they gonna win hands down compare to little 'nissan' from japan. and they also flushed with great technologies and gizmos as the nissan.

the only thing godzilla fans will be able to hold on is the pure power the 35 has and they will brag about that timing in Nurburging for ever.

but the record lapping time....is it matters at all?

i dont think so even for a minute
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    adam
  • Jun 4, 2008
like autocar put it, the company that produces DATSUN at one time.. or SENTRA nowadays, emm..

no doubt it's a legend, but a nissan no less.. gimme a Nissan GTR and i won't complaint though.. :D but to buy one over other marque, i'd think twice..
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    bangkai_jk
  • Jun 4, 2008
its all about balancing for driving presure, not power nor technology :)
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    king_jamez
  • Jun 4, 2008
cant deny that the M3 is a great car...but i dun think BMW build the M3 to compare wit the GT-R ans Porsche...it's not even in the same category...M3 might lose the power stats compared to the other 2 but i love M3 to the bits...it's just simply stunning...=) but a good battle between the 3 wont hurt...ehehe
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    pandaB
  • Jun 4, 2008
still like the new gtr....dont need stats to like. its a pure as it is...woohoo~ : )
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    deacon
  • Jun 4, 2008
drM while you have made some interesting arguments i'm afraid BMW and German automakers are far from the quality they once held. In this day and age Lexus is king of luxury and sophisticated. As you so eloquently put while lap times may not matter much to a brand what other factor is there to compare especially if a Lexus (a Jap car) whoops BMWs in terms of reliability sales and overall car maker of the year awards?
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    deacon
  • Jun 4, 2008
i meant to type sophistication my bad.
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    deacon
  • Jun 4, 2008
Nissan and Infiniti aren't far off in case some may have missed my point.
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    joe_mivec
  • Jun 4, 2008
come on, power is nothing without a great power distribution. look at GTR with it high efficiency traction control can outperformed any car with higher power. M3 with 420hp NA engine loosing lot of power from engine because it rwd configuration. GTR also great for daily usage, with it high technology in electronically power distribution control.
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    bocabill
  • Dec 9, 2008
The 911 Turbo is beautiful and fast but not as muscular looking and doesn't have the M3's addicting V8 sound. The GTR is just another piece of ugly, overpriced, Japanese junk. The M3 is a much cooler ride than the other two for all around appeal, even if it's not as fast. It doesn't have to be.
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    A1diablo
  • Dec 9, 2008
Though I do agree with your view on the 911 Turbo and M3 over the GTR, I totally disagree with your take on it being 'overpriced' and 'junk'. I think the GTR seems underpriced against the europeans given its technical prowess and pedigree. Yes it has pedigree! Read about the Skyline GTR R32, it's ancestor from 3 generations previous and how it was banned from competition. This was in 1991 and it already had 4 wheel drive, 4 wheel steer, a monster engine, superb handling which obliterated the competition.

Given that it's performance is well above the 911 Turbo and in fact actually closer to the Carrera GT, the GTR seems underpriced. It's not just about dropping a monster of an engine but the whole car IS seriously incredibly advanced and efficient techhnologically as had always been the case with previous GTRs(Skylines).

Having said that I will admit if I was handed the keys to either the 911 Turbo, M3 or GTR, I will grab the 911, maybe even M3 knowing full well the GTR is more advanced technically and quicker.

Though personally I would look for the keys for the Carrera GT, which to me is a piece of engineering art.
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